Yet another palm...

Therrin · 13th March 2008, 04:37 PM

Got a palm job coming up. Fairly straightforward, not like those messy ones I posted pics of last time.
It's about 30' tall, 3' dbh.
H.O. wants it removed.

West side

East side

Full picture

What's the problem with the trunk on the east side? What causes that?

Any other advice/suggestions for this removal would be appreciated.

I was thinking about rigging down the top half, then blocking down the rest onto an old mattress in about 12" to 18" sections. It's probably heavier than I think though.
Just out of the picture (in the direction they'd tumble) is a nice bricked in mailbox.

newguy18 · 13th March 2008, 05:47 PM

i'm not sure what causes that but i've noticed it on most of the palms i've cleaned or removed as well,as for blocking down i wouldn't push any bigger than 12" for the simple fact that since i pinched that nerve i've had a hard time lifting and climbing like i used to and remember use that bore wing cut,it works great.

If there is room maybe have someone on the ground pull the sections off the trunk to save fumbling around and to save time.

playfordtree · 13th March 2008, 07:30 PM

That sure is an ugly MoFo Therrin.
Thats a palm only a mother could love.

I just did one about the same size on monday, messy bloody thing, it hadn't been pruned so it still had a full beard that was full of pidgeons and pidgeon crap.

I decked the whole thing straight onto their back lawn.
I used Ekka's rope over the top technique, she came down with a mighty whack (must have weighed about 3 tonnes i reckon)

If you have got the room just deck it, they come over nice and predictable.

Ekka's good old borewing cuts work well when your cutting it up on the ground as well.

JohN Dee · 13th March 2008, 08:13 PM

Can't you fell it towards or across the neighbours yard? Looks like ya could in that east pic... If not just climb up abit and head it just below those talons.

I'm not to sure what that brown crap is but I'll take a stab and say that it is some form of rot? Ekka should be able to alleviate you on that anyways..

Therrin · 13th March 2008, 10:06 PM

To tell the truth I'm actually quite timid about the thought of decking it.

Looks like alot of weight to me, I'd prefer to have a couple of big palms under my belt and the opportunity to fell some without needing to worry about hitting anything, to get a feel for them, before I do that.
- also not sure of the effects of dropping a couple tons right down on someone's lawn and driveway. I'd hate to leave their driveway in pieces and the lawn sunken.

Was considering speedlining, along with having the groundy pull the blocks off onto the line, but wasn't sure if that's asking for trouble with the weight.

any trouble climbing over the previously-cutoff stubs? Do I need to trim them closer first, or don't worry about it?

Ekka · 13th March 2008, 10:12 PM

I'd be doing that one of two ways.

1/ Go up half way and whack it, fits easy in the lawn patch.

2/ Whack it from just above the root ball straight out toward the street, looks like there's room. If you are worried about busting the footpath I bring foams, boards and a length of timber or log etc. Lay the board on the lawn just before to footpath, then the foams, then the log ... aim well and hit it so that the palm doesn't touch the footpath.

That's a Washingtonia filifera I think, a demon palm anyway worse than the normal robusta. It is very dense inside, very heavy, and lordy help you if you have to cut it up to lift it. As palms get fatter they get way harder to cut and clamping of the bar goes on.

That last 1m of root crap will blunt your chain bad if not trash it, do that last.

The brown crap is some sort of surface rot/stain ... worry not, you'll have tons of hinge wood.

Remember side wings cuts or fibre cuts to prevent tearing.

dannyboysfc · 13th March 2008, 11:01 PM

Thats one fat heavy palm, Washingtonia Filifera is correct Ekka.

Id put some sheets of plywood on the lawn as a drop zone to protect the turf and irrigation if it were me, and then take it in 3rds with the help of a groundy to help pull each piece over using a normal notch, kerf and back cut.

Palm is heavy, I wouldn't attempt to drop that over a sidewalk or driveway unless you like to do concrete repairs for free.

playfordtree · 14th March 2008, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

To tell the truth I'm actually quite timid about the thought of decking it.

Thats a very honest answer Therrin, only the best of men put their honesty before their ego!

You will be fine mate, that looks like the perfect palm to do your first deck.
Challenging but not too difficult (you might die waiting for the perfect deck)

Just use plenty of foam and boards and stuff like the other boys said, and you should have no worries mate.
(well spotted with the sprinkler system danny)

Put your logs/bricks/pieces of timber or whatever on either side of the path, that way the palm wont even touch the concrete

As for the lawn, the very worst case scenario is that you will have to buy a couple of wheelbarrow loads of sandy loam and backfill the dents.
Again, if your carefull you should have no worries.

If you want to look really good, lay a few of those cheap plastic tarps on the ground where the palm will fall.
That will make it easier to clean up the 200lb of wet sawdust thats left after you cut it up.

Good luck.

Regards Simon

P.s. if you do decide to deck it, make sure you take your video camera.
I wanna see how pumped up you are after you pull it off, I can tell your a bit of a "livewire".

Therrin · 14th March 2008, 03:36 AM

Danny,

Will a normal notch, kerf, and backcut bind in something like that or do I do a bore-wing with it?

Playford,

Thx for the advice. I'll scrounge the stuff up. I liked the tarp idea. I had actually already gotten a cap for the riser under that sprinkler head.

Livewire???

Meee??

That's pretty accurate =)

playfordtree · 14th March 2008, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

I'll scrounge the stuff up.

I like your thinking.

"Necessity is the mother of invention"

or should that be,

"Necessity is a Mutha, we need an invention"

newguy18 · 14th March 2008, 06:59 AM

oh and another note clean off where the fronds used to be,they don't make for good footing.

Ekka · 14th March 2008, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Danny,

Will a normal notch, kerf, and backcut bind in something like that or do I do a bore-wing with it?

Just do everything normal, you will need a good pull rope and WEDGES.

You need to "relief, side fibre or wing cut" where the notch is, level with the bottom, cut in about 2" to make sure the outer fibres bust on both sides. Which they normally do on those but best to be sure.

Make sure the back cut is horizontal, even hinge. Put wedges in as you go.

Then when the back cut is done, you've got the hinge around 2" thick, wedges (2 of them) are in, you piss off out of the way and pull it over.

Mess this up and you get booted outta here, no place for fools, there's other places you can go to be an idiot and fit in.

Here's a diagram explaining those "wing cuts".

Therrin · 14th March 2008, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Mess this up and you get booted outta here, no place for fools, there's other places you can go to be an idiot and fit in.

Whoa.... it's like a TW indoctrination coupled with a trial-by-fire.

Thanks for the advice/diagram Ekka.

TreeDimensional · 14th March 2008, 05:23 PM

Hey Therrin, you feeling a little pressure? This is where principles and practice meet. I am sure Ekka has given you sound advice. Use your head, look at the situation from every angle, and act with conviction.

If the little voice in your head is still bugging you, it might be wise to find that mentor. You aren't feeling any more OR less pressure than other tree removal person has.

There seems to be room for a bit of error there (hard to tell from photos), but keep in mind to error on the side of caution. That means, its better to have to fix a driveway/mailbox/etc than it is to fix a house.

Use the knowledge you've acquired, and good luck!

Quintrex · 16th March 2008, 03:19 AM

if you can find some old pallets, they can help protect the lawn and bridge the concrete etc.

Ekka · 16th March 2008, 03:39 AM

Tyres or tires for yanks are also good.

Just remember to take video.

13th March 2008, 04:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,273	Yet another palm... Got a palm job coming up. Fairly straightforward, not like those messy ones I posted pics of last time. It's about 30' tall, 3' dbh. H.O. wants it removed. West side East side Full picture What's the problem with the trunk on the east side? What causes that? Any other advice/suggestions for this removal would be appreciated. I was thinking about rigging down the top half, then blocking down the rest onto an old mattress in about 12" to 18" sections. It's probably heavier than I think though. Just out of the picture (in the direction they'd tumble) is a nice bricked in mailbox. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

13th March 2008, 05:47 PM	#2 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,679	Re: Yet another palm... i'm not sure what causes that but i've noticed it on most of the palms i've cleaned or removed as well,as for blocking down i wouldn't push any bigger than 12" for the simple fact that since i pinched that nerve i've had a hard time lifting and climbing like i used to and remember use that bore wing cut,it works great.If there is room maybe have someone on the ground pull the sections off the trunk to save fumbling around and to save time. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

13th March 2008, 07:30 PM	#3 (permalink)
playfordtree Mature tree Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Adelaide Australia Posts: 340	Re: Yet another palm... That sure is an ugly MoFo Therrin. Thats a palm only a mother could love. I just did one about the same size on monday, messy bloody thing, it hadn't been pruned so it still had a full beard that was full of pidgeons and pidgeon crap. I decked the whole thing straight onto their back lawn. I used Ekka's rope over the top technique, she came down with a mighty whack (must have weighed about 3 tonnes i reckon) If you have got the room just deck it, they come over nice and predictable. Ekka's good old borewing cuts work well when your cutting it up on the ground as well. __________________ I Drink Therefore I am.

13th March 2008, 08:13 PM	#4 (permalink)
JohN Dee Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 750	Re: Yet another palm... Can't you fell it towards or across the neighbours yard? Looks like ya could in that east pic... If not just climb up abit and head it just below those talons. I'm not to sure what that brown crap is but I'll take a stab and say that it is some form of rot? Ekka should be able to alleviate you on that anyways.. __________________ Climber with slow climbing speed, must make up with mighty chainsaw roar. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Red : Green : Blue

13th March 2008, 10:06 PM	#5 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,273	Re: Yet another palm... To tell the truth I'm actually quite timid about the thought of decking it. Looks like alot of weight to me, I'd prefer to have a couple of big palms under my belt and the opportunity to fell some without needing to worry about hitting anything, to get a feel for them, before I do that. - also not sure of the effects of dropping a couple tons right down on someone's lawn and driveway. I'd hate to leave their driveway in pieces and the lawn sunken. Was considering speedlining, along with having the groundy pull the blocks off onto the line, but wasn't sure if that's asking for trouble with the weight. any trouble climbing over the previously-cutoff stubs? Do I need to trim them closer first, or don't worry about it? __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

13th March 2008, 10:12 PM	#6 (permalink)
Ekka Eric Frei Administrator - Brisbane L5 (Dip) Hort Cert III Arb + some Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 6,933	Re: Yet another palm... I'd be doing that one of two ways. 1/ Go up half way and whack it, fits easy in the lawn patch. 2/ Whack it from just above the root ball straight out toward the street, looks like there's room. If you are worried about busting the footpath I bring foams, boards and a length of timber or log etc. Lay the board on the lawn just before to footpath, then the foams, then the log ... aim well and hit it so that the palm doesn't touch the footpath. That's a Washingtonia filifera I think, a demon palm anyway worse than the normal robusta. It is very dense inside, very heavy, and lordy help you if you have to cut it up to lift it. As palms get fatter they get way harder to cut and clamping of the bar goes on. That last 1m of root crap will blunt your chain bad if not trash it, do that last. The brown crap is some sort of surface rot/stain ... worry not, you'll have tons of hinge wood. Remember side wings cuts or fibre cuts to prevent tearing. __________________ Remember to use the "search" function, if you have answers/questions post them so everyone can benefit. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding and Stump Removal Brisbane Brisbane Tree Care, Consultations, Developer, Tree and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

13th March 2008, 11:01 PM	#7 (permalink)
dannyboysfc Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: California Posts: 121	Re: Yet another palm... Thats one fat heavy palm, Washingtonia Filifera is correct Ekka. Id put some sheets of plywood on the lawn as a drop zone to protect the turf and irrigation if it were me, and then take it in 3rds with the help of a groundy to help pull each piece over using a normal notch, kerf and back cut. Palm is heavy, I wouldn't attempt to drop that over a sidewalk or driveway unless you like to do concrete repairs for free.

14th March 2008, 03:36 AM	#9 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,273	Re: Yet another palm... Danny, Will a normal notch, kerf, and backcut bind in something like that or do I do a bore-wing with it? Playford, Thx for the advice. I'll scrounge the stuff up. I liked the tarp idea. I had actually already gotten a cap for the riser under that sprinkler head. Livewire??? Meee?? That's pretty accurate =) __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

14th March 2008, 06:59 AM	#11 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,679	Re: Yet another palm... oh and another note clean off where the fronds used to be,they don't make for good footing. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

14th March 2008, 05:23 PM	#14 (permalink)
TreeDimensional Banned Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 381	Re: Yet another palm... Hey Therrin, you feeling a little pressure? This is where principles and practice meet. I am sure Ekka has given you sound advice. Use your head, look at the situation from every angle, and act with conviction. If the little voice in your head is still bugging you, it might be wise to find that mentor. You aren't feeling any more OR less pressure than other tree removal person has. There seems to be room for a bit of error there (hard to tell from photos), but keep in mind to error on the side of caution. That means, its better to have to fix a driveway/mailbox/etc than it is to fix a house. Use the knowledge you've acquired, and good luck!

16th March 2008, 03:19 AM	#15 (permalink)
Quintrex Mature tree Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 462	Re: Yet another palm... if you can find some old pallets, they can help protect the lawn and bridge the concrete etc. __________________ Heightmaster

16th March 2008, 03:39 AM	#16 (permalink)
Ekka Eric Frei Administrator - Brisbane L5 (Dip) Hort Cert III Arb + some Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 6,933	Re: Yet another palm... Tyres or tires for yanks are also good. Just remember to take video. __________________ Remember to use the "search" function, if you have answers/questions post them so everyone can benefit. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding and Stump Removal Brisbane Brisbane Tree Care, Consultations, Developer, Tree and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors