Transplant small trees method

TrevMcRev · 1st May 2007, 07:15 AM

Anyone seen this method of transplanting small trees before?

Interesting, a bit of mucking around but looks effective.

http://easylink.playstream.com/nurse...84K_Stream.wvx

Ekka · 1st May 2007, 03:13 PM

Hey, good idea.

Wouldn't be too hard to knock up something like that yourself.

Hey, I laughed when the guy goes get the long handled pruners so you dont place yourself at risk should the root ball fall ... then he gets straight behind it with the burlap.

Here many people want palms transplanted, biggest problem is the weight and height of the palm. Not only do you have the root ball but also the half tonne palm.

For smaller ones you can get a sharp spade , come out a foot from the base and go in at a 45 degree angle and pop them out like a cone. But it takes some to cut all the roots, sharpen your spade like a knife with an angle grinder.

Good find Trev.

TrevMcRev · 1st May 2007, 07:14 PM

Yeah i thought the spade would be easy enough to fashion up yourself. A bit more involved if ya want the lifting hooks and frame. But i think you do a fair bit with the spade alone.

osb_mail · 2nd May 2007, 06:16 PM

I have moved alot of trees with just a spade but usally had a skid loader to lift it out of the hole when done cutting roots . I know the 1inch of trunk caliper to 12 inches of root ball is kind of standard , but still seems kind of small to me . I wonder how much time it would take to move a 3inch caliper tree with this system I would guess 1 to 2 hours . I have been hearing about people moving trees bare root using a airspade and some kind of digging device (shovel , spade ,backhoe ) , now that is a idea that really interest me you could probably only move during the time the trees were dormant (winter) . I think it would be a amazing thing to look at all the roots select witch ones you want . Also you would in turn have less weight meaning you could move bigger trees with less machine power . You would also have a visible root flare so figure planting depth would be easier .

Tree Machine · 3rd May 2007, 06:50 AM

Good point's, osb.

I love the idea of planting trees of up to 6" caliper, but as an Arborist, it's not what we do. Now, don't get me wrong and I'm not trying to dissuede anyone from going ahead and planting trees, but I'm specifically talking as an Arborist, a tree care professional; planting trees is landscape. There is no climbing, no pruning, there is no care. Getting a tree up and out of the ground is one thing, but there's the other end of site preparation, which amounts to quite a bit more if you're to do it right, but basically, you are digging a hole, making a mess with a bunch of soil and then cleaning it up.

You earn a living digging holes, what about from where you took the tree? Is it necessary to back fill the hole? How many people do you need to involve and communicate with to get this one tree moved?

Planting a tree, and I have done it many dozens of times in all seasons, is a lot of work, and a very committed chunk of time. You can't bail mid-stream because it's too hard, it's one of those projects that has to be seen through, no matter how long it's taking. And there's the chance your transplant might not make it.

Arborists climb and care for and remove trees. Landscape and nursery plants trees. We plant trees, we take a pay cut.

I'm, of course, speaking in a broad, generalized manner. I'm just giving a bit of forewarning and insight into what you're getting yourself into when transplanting a tree, if you are an Arborist and I only drive that detail home because this is an Arborist forum site.

That's my schpeel on possible reasons why you, as a climber or owner of a bucket should not be out digging holes. For the rest of you, I will aid in any way to help out in your quest to plant trees. I find it noble, the right thing to do and part of the solution to saving our environment. I am all for planting trees, and teaching others to plant trees.

That 15 minute video was very enlightning. My mind kept going to how the system could be improved, and how would a much larger, wheeled version to pop and transport palms look?

I would buy their system just out of the respect for the time they took to develop it and give us one of the best tree transplant videos out there. Then I would modify the thing to become a wheeled device, by simply welding an axel in the right spot, and then adding wheels when necessary.

But I doubt I will buy one. I don't want to get into planting trees, not in the business sense anyway. I have to sell this idea to my wife, making an investment so I can take a pay cut. I see the sense in this, but not me wifey.

Ekka · 3rd May 2007, 07:22 AM

It's good to have these discussions, the time, effort, energy involved with transplants is way under estimated by customers.

Trees like that shown on the video would be tub grown here in a big bag and just shipped off no digging.

Many times it's cheaper to buy one of them than transplant one.

The fig trees for Sydney's Olympic stadium were transplanted from Queensland. Floated down on a barge ... we are talking phenomenal costs that home-owners seldom fork out for ... govs, developers etc sure, they got the bucks.

But it's still good to know these things as they are options, but saving trees and moving them often (99%) of the time will cost a lot more than cutting them down.

TrevMcRev · 3rd May 2007, 07:33 AM

Yeah agreed few will pay to do it properly. This could make the small ones quick enough that its worth it though.

I also "pinch" the odd tree client wants gone. With their permission i dig it out and put them at my place.

My 20 month old garden has established hedges and trees from 5 - 35 years old. And LOTS of mulch!

osb_mail · 3rd May 2007, 05:51 PM

I am a landscaper I dig trees ,plant them ,mulch , prune them .I know some people tree climbers/workers would take offense to the fact that I call my self a arborist .I am a ISA certified arborist but I work for landscaping company. Here is something consider A 5to6ft spruce would cost a homeowner anywhere from 75 to 120 dollars . I can buy them for 30 to 35 dollars a piece ,so I could almost plant trees make money and homeowners would be paying the same as if they went and bought it at the nursery. I would say in most cases I could dig and plant a tree a hour by hand I know that you have to pick them up and stuff but still if you planted 10 at a job one guy could make 700 - 800 dollars day .

TrevMcRev · 3rd May 2007, 08:53 PM

Agreed osb,

We do a bit of replanting for customers, not shrubs or anything small, but advanced trees yes.

I think it is a perfect fit for an arboricultural business. We can give real advice on what to plant, select good stock free of defects, purchase direct from growers, plant correctly, formatively prune them etc.

Theres a lot of heavy specialised work and equipment needed to do "real' tree work and we all complain we dont get paid well enough for it.

With replanting its easy to double a $1500 removal job into a $3000 remove/replant job and i can tell you the 2nd 1/2 is easier money than the first.

Here to a lot of councils permits specify replanting with a suitable replacment canopy tree as a condition of granting the removal permit.

mdvaden · 4th May 2007, 09:03 PM

As far as a video goes, its actually quite good. I thought it was informative.

I suppose that the technique would be reasonable for certain people in certain locations.

For my needs, it would be a gamble, because only a few stones in the soil, would dull and nullify the use of those tools.

In north Oregon, the soil is fairly decent. But very often, bits of debris, or stones from construction, get mixed in the soil. And that's where many small transplants happen.

In a way, I enjoy excavating from around the tree and exploring to see what's going on around the tree. If there are irrigation lines, I need to find those and saw them off.

My ways are quite primitive, but practical...

http://www.mdvaden.com/transplanting.shtml I just linked a tiny video from the page showing my favorite method for using a tarp to cradle and slide the trees out of the hole.

The majority of trees I move, are that size, and half the time, from one part of the yard to the other.

Only about 15% of the transplants I've done, would have accomodated that gadget.

Nonetheless, I think its a cool video. It has one advantage of being able to select the right tree in the right soil for the video, though. No rocks, no roots big enough to stop the spade, and good soil. Excellent for sales.

DRANO · 5th May 2007, 06:24 PM

WELL HELLO !! mario thanks for telling me off this site,i like the international feeL!the company davey tree moves some of the largest tree's in the world.i am actually doing the course large tree moving and transplanting right now just the basics and i'll never do it but now i have a idea on the intensity of the job!!of course i work for davey but someone else can move the big one's !!lol take care all DRANO

Sean Freeman · 5th May 2007, 06:30 PM

Hi DRANO and welcome, Davey and National Shade (they might be one in the same now!) have really developed some of the best custom methods and techniques for successfully moving truely immense trees. We have not seen the use of gantry lifting here in Oz, but you never know if the right client and tree come together......

All the best

Ekka · 5th May 2007, 07:43 PM

Drano,

It would be good to hear what the pre lift schedule is, like months before what is being done to the tree etc.

mdvaden · 5th May 2007, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRANO

WELL HELLO !! mario thanks for telling me off this site,i like the international feeL!the company davey tree moves some of the largest tree's in the world.i am actually doing the course large tree moving and transplanting right now just the basics and i'll never do it but now i have a idea on the intensity of the job!!of course i work for davey but someone else can move the big one's !!lol take care all DRANO

Welcome.

Just noticed your message. You dropped in a nice mellow topic for starters. A bit different flavor here from the site we met on.

Maybe down the line, "Newt" may join in.

I thought she was a man first time I saw here user name.

(everyone else, Newt is a very friendly non-professional woman who really enjoys getting info to people on garden forums. Excellent forum contributor - one of the best.)

DRANO · 6th May 2007, 07:45 PM

just in digging up and moving any tree,apprropriate species and its tolerance to moving is first thing to consider.consideration to the tree for moving preoeration may be years ahead as to pruning/cabling.root proonong and fertilization to the move.it is not something you just go and do that day or week for sure of course this prep is what im talking about very large historic types.your next site must be analized and prepared well in advance too.alot more ill put in as i get thru it lol drano

DRANO · 6th May 2007, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRANO

just in digging up and moving any tree,apprropriate species and its tolerance to moving is first thing to consider.consideration to the tree for moving preoeration may be years ahead as to pruning/cabling.root proonong and fertilization to the move.it is not something you just go and do that day or week for sure of course this prep is what im talking about very large historic types.your next site must be analized and prepared well in advance too.alot more ill put in as i get thru it lol drano

1st May 2007, 07:15 AM	#1 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 973	Transplant small trees method Anyone seen this method of transplanting small trees before? Interesting, a bit of mucking around but looks effective. http://easylink.playstream.com/nurse...84K_Stream.wvx __________________ Total Tree Care - Melbourne Arborist Reports & Consulting,Tree Pruning & Removal www.treegear.com.au - Australia's Best Value Arborist Supplies

1st May 2007, 03:13 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ekka Admin - Dip Arb & Hort Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 7,734	Hey, good idea. Wouldn't be too hard to knock up something like that yourself. Hey, I laughed when the guy goes get the long handled pruners so you dont place yourself at risk should the root ball fall ... then he gets straight behind it with the burlap. Here many people want palms transplanted, biggest problem is the weight and height of the palm. Not only do you have the root ball but also the half tonne palm. For smaller ones you can get a sharp spade , come out a foot from the base and go in at a 45 degree angle and pop them out like a cone. But it takes some to cut all the roots, sharpen your spade like a knife with an angle grinder. Good find Trev. __________________ Arborist Training in Australia\| Your Free Helping Guide Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory .... Yes, I also SEO (Optimize) and build websites that fly high in Google Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding and Stump Removal Brisbane Brisbane - Gold Coast Tree Care, Consulting, Developer, Tree and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

1st May 2007, 07:14 PM	#3 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 973	Yeah i thought the spade would be easy enough to fashion up yourself. A bit more involved if ya want the lifting hooks and frame. But i think you do a fair bit with the spade alone. __________________ Total Tree Care - Melbourne Arborist Reports & Consulting,Tree Pruning & Removal www.treegear.com.au - Australia's Best Value Arborist Supplies

3rd May 2007, 07:22 AM	#6 (permalink)
Ekka Admin - Dip Arb & Hort Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 7,734	It's good to have these discussions, the time, effort, energy involved with transplants is way under estimated by customers. Trees like that shown on the video would be tub grown here in a big bag and just shipped off no digging. Many times it's cheaper to buy one of them than transplant one. The fig trees for Sydney's Olympic stadium were transplanted from Queensland. Floated down on a barge ... we are talking phenomenal costs that home-owners seldom fork out for ... govs, developers etc sure, they got the bucks. But it's still good to know these things as they are options, but saving trees and moving them often (99%) of the time will cost a lot more than cutting them down. __________________ Arborist Training in Australia\| Your Free Helping Guide Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory .... Yes, I also SEO (Optimize) and build websites that fly high in Google Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding and Stump Removal Brisbane Brisbane - Gold Coast Tree Care, Consulting, Developer, Tree and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

3rd May 2007, 07:33 AM	#7 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 973	Yeah agreed few will pay to do it properly. This could make the small ones quick enough that its worth it though. I also "pinch" the odd tree client wants gone. With their permission i dig it out and put them at my place. My 20 month old garden has established hedges and trees from 5 - 35 years old. And LOTS of mulch! __________________ Total Tree Care - Melbourne Arborist Reports & Consulting,Tree Pruning & Removal www.treegear.com.au - Australia's Best Value Arborist Supplies

2nd May 2007, 06:16 PM	#4 (permalink)
osb_mail Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: ohio Posts: 219	I have moved alot of trees with just a spade but usally had a skid loader to lift it out of the hole when done cutting roots . I know the 1inch of trunk caliper to 12 inches of root ball is kind of standard , but still seems kind of small to me . I wonder how much time it would take to move a 3inch caliper tree with this system I would guess 1 to 2 hours . I have been hearing about people moving trees bare root using a airspade and some kind of digging device (shovel , spade ,backhoe ) , now that is a idea that really interest me you could probably only move during the time the trees were dormant (winter) . I think it would be a amazing thing to look at all the roots select witch ones you want . Also you would in turn have less weight meaning you could move bigger trees with less machine power . You would also have a visible root flare so figure planting depth would be easier .

3rd May 2007, 06:50 AM	#5 (permalink)
Tree Machine Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 714	Good point's, osb. I love the idea of planting trees of up to 6" caliper, but as an Arborist, it's not what we do. Now, don't get me wrong and I'm not trying to dissuede anyone from going ahead and planting trees, but I'm specifically talking as an Arborist, a tree care professional; planting trees is landscape. There is no climbing, no pruning, there is no care. Getting a tree up and out of the ground is one thing, but there's the other end of site preparation, which amounts to quite a bit more if you're to do it right, but basically, you are digging a hole, making a mess with a bunch of soil and then cleaning it up. You earn a living digging holes, what about from where you took the tree? Is it necessary to back fill the hole? How many people do you need to involve and communicate with to get this one tree moved? Planting a tree, and I have done it many dozens of times in all seasons, is a lot of work, and a very committed chunk of time. You can't bail mid-stream because it's too hard, it's one of those projects that has to be seen through, no matter how long it's taking. And there's the chance your transplant might not make it. Arborists climb and care for and remove trees. Landscape and nursery plants trees. We plant trees, we take a pay cut. I'm, of course, speaking in a broad, generalized manner. I'm just giving a bit of forewarning and insight into what you're getting yourself into when transplanting a tree, if you are an Arborist and I only drive that detail home because this is an Arborist forum site. That's my schpeel on possible reasons why you, as a climber or owner of a bucket should not be out digging holes. For the rest of you, I will aid in any way to help out in your quest to plant trees. I find it noble, the right thing to do and part of the solution to saving our environment. I am all for planting trees, and teaching others to plant trees. That 15 minute video was very enlightning. My mind kept going to how the system could be improved, and how would a much larger, wheeled version to pop and transport palms look? I would buy their system just out of the respect for the time they took to develop it and give us one of the best tree transplant videos out there. Then I would modify the thing to become a wheeled device, by simply welding an axel in the right spot, and then adding wheels when necessary. But I doubt I will buy one. I don't want to get into planting trees, not in the business sense anyway. I have to sell this idea to my wife, making an investment so I can take a pay cut. I see the sense in this, but not me wifey.

3rd May 2007, 05:51 PM	#8 (permalink)
osb_mail Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: ohio Posts: 219	I am a landscaper I dig trees ,plant them ,mulch , prune them .I know some people tree climbers/workers would take offense to the fact that I call my self a arborist .I am a ISA certified arborist but I work for landscaping company. Here is something consider A 5to6ft spruce would cost a homeowner anywhere from 75 to 120 dollars . I can buy them for 30 to 35 dollars a piece ,so I could almost plant trees make money and homeowners would be paying the same as if they went and bought it at the nursery. I would say in most cases I could dig and plant a tree a hour by hand I know that you have to pick them up and stuff but still if you planted 10 at a job one guy could make 700 - 800 dollars day .

3rd May 2007, 08:53 PM	#9 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 973	Agreed osb, We do a bit of replanting for customers, not shrubs or anything small, but advanced trees yes. I think it is a perfect fit for an arboricultural business. We can give real advice on what to plant, select good stock free of defects, purchase direct from growers, plant correctly, formatively prune them etc. Theres a lot of heavy specialised work and equipment needed to do "real' tree work and we all complain we dont get paid well enough for it. With replanting its easy to double a $1500 removal job into a $3000 remove/replant job and i can tell you the 2nd 1/2 is easier money than the first. Here to a lot of councils permits specify replanting with a suitable replacment canopy tree as a condition of granting the removal permit. __________________ Total Tree Care - Melbourne Arborist Reports & Consulting,Tree Pruning & Removal www.treegear.com.au - Australia's Best Value Arborist Supplies

4th May 2007, 09:03 PM	#10 (permalink)
mdvaden Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 451	As far as a video goes, its actually quite good. I thought it was informative. I suppose that the technique would be reasonable for certain people in certain locations. For my needs, it would be a gamble, because only a few stones in the soil, would dull and nullify the use of those tools. In north Oregon, the soil is fairly decent. But very often, bits of debris, or stones from construction, get mixed in the soil. And that's where many small transplants happen. In a way, I enjoy excavating from around the tree and exploring to see what's going on around the tree. If there are irrigation lines, I need to find those and saw them off. My ways are quite primitive, but practical... http://www.mdvaden.com/transplanting.shtml I just linked a tiny video from the page showing my favorite method for using a tarp to cradle and slide the trees out of the hole. The majority of trees I move, are that size, and half the time, from one part of the yard to the other. Only about 15% of the transplants I've done, would have accomodated that gadget. Nonetheless, I think its a cool video. It has one advantage of being able to select the right tree in the right soil for the video, though. No rocks, no roots big enough to stop the spade, and good soil. Excellent for sales. __________________ ____________________________________ Grove of Redwood TITANS Oregon BIGOOT trap

5th May 2007, 06:24 PM	#11 (permalink)
DRANO Sappling Join Date: May 2007 Location: VERMONT Posts: 25	WELL HELLO !! mario thanks for telling me off this site,i like the international feeL!the company davey tree moves some of the largest tree's in the world.i am actually doing the course large tree moving and transplanting right now just the basics and i'll never do it but now i have a idea on the intensity of the job!!of course i work for davey but someone else can move the big one's !!lol take care all DRANO

5th May 2007, 06:30 PM	#12 (permalink)
Sean Freeman PDF King & Arborist Extrodinaire Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Townsville Nth Queensland & Gold Coast Sth Queensland Posts: 1,868	Hi DRANO and welcome, Davey and National Shade (they might be one in the same now!) have really developed some of the best custom methods and techniques for successfully moving truely immense trees. We have not seen the use of gantry lifting here in Oz, but you never know if the right client and tree come together...... All the best __________________ Sean Trees are poems that earth writes upon the sky, We fell them down and turn them into paper, That we may record our emptiness. - Kahlil Gibran

5th May 2007, 07:43 PM	#13 (permalink)
Ekka Admin - Dip Arb & Hort Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 7,734	Drano, It would be good to hear what the pre lift schedule is, like months before what is being done to the tree etc. __________________ Arborist Training in Australia\| Your Free Helping Guide Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory .... Yes, I also SEO (Optimize) and build websites that fly high in Google Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding and Stump Removal Brisbane Brisbane - Gold Coast Tree Care, Consulting, Developer, Tree and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

6th May 2007, 07:45 PM	#15 (permalink)
DRANO Sappling Join Date: May 2007 Location: VERMONT Posts: 25	just in digging up and moving any tree,apprropriate species and its tolerance to moving is first thing to consider.consideration to the tree for moving preoeration may be years ahead as to pruning/cabling.root proonong and fertilization to the move.it is not something you just go and do that day or week for sure of course this prep is what im talking about very large historic types.your next site must be analized and prepared well in advance too.alot more ill put in as i get thru it lol drano