one handing a top handle saw

NeTree

One-handing a top-handled saw- when done with careful consideration of risk, hazard, alternatives, and surroundings- can be a legitimate tool in the arborists' box.

NeTree

Gee, didn't mean to kill the thread...

stirmantrees

i agree netree. that was a good way to state it
i think there is alot of traffic going right through this thread without comment.
i have a feeling that many that may cast the first stone are witholding there commenting until they see me in another thread in a picture cutting with one hand, then the will blast away. even though they may do it themselves.
whatever, im here to learn and talk. transparency for me reaps greater rewards. atleast with matters such as these
says alot for those that have commented
every tree cutter has an opinion on this. i do it to much for sure and improving.
when specifically do you use one hand on the saw?
any close calls?
i think dead tree situations can justify the use.

NeTree

To answer your last question first, no; I've never had a "close call" while one-handing. I attribute that fact to being very judicious in doing so, and maintaining extra awareness of the added risk involved.

One example I could give is when using one hand on the saw to finish the back cut on a top while using the other hand on the bucket control to turn away asd the top starts to go. There are many situations where the top can only swing in one direction, and you can only set up in one place. In these situations, I'll start the cut two-handed of course, and adjust myself so the saw is at arms' length.

southsoundtree

I think that it is a reality for most people at some point. If you work conifers, then it is even more common.

I think that a single TIP while cutting is a larger hazard, and almost always will flip a lanyard around when I'm dangling off the climbline.

A way to reduce the need/ potential danger is to partially cut through the branch with the chainsaw, then finish with a handsaw.

If I'm doing removals and need to grab the branch, I'll often cut with both hands until it starts to release, then put the spinning-down chain on my MS192t onto the trunk of the tree, and reach out to grab the falling branch on the way down. I've stopped the chain from spinning in a quick, efficient motion, away from myself or my climbline/ lanyard and can go for the branch effectively.

I think that strength and dexterity are major components in this discussion. If you can hold up an MS 250 by the back handle/ pistol grip (not suggesting to ever cut this way, then you are in a better position to one-hand a top-handle. If you can accurately cut a face with one hand on a top-handle, you are in a better position to one-hand it in other scenarios.

The longterm wear and tear on the body is another factor in this debate that is not raised very often.

Virtually every time that I'm cutting near my self or equipment I give extra scrutiny of the situation when I'm assessing the risk. Constant risk assessment is necessary in all aspects of treework. There are lots more dangerous things that people do that are not explicitly written anywhere, so they get less publicity.

Just as some people can drive safely at 20% above the speed limit, there are people out there that shouldn't be driving, even if they are legal to do so. Look into each situation and individual person, individually.

newguy18

They are a very professional company,great benefits and they get me any piece of gear i want,i just have an understanding with my boss,he lets me do my thing and doesn't bug me to much,although i had to meet him halfway and use a damn steel core lanyard.Dog i hate those things.I never do anything i'm not certain of and once you devolp a sixth sense persay and listen to it you'll be fine.

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old schooler

alinicoll

I quite regularly use top handled saws one handed, thats what they`re designed for. However, i do use two hands alot too.

Apocalypsse

You should tell that to this guy:

NeTree

Clearly, one-handing his saw is the least of his issues.

Garry Brockley

its like a "how not to" video, jesus noone wore any safety gear, well at least he looked cool in his sunny's while butchering that tree. she looked so proud of her hacker men.

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Eric Frei

Well, my first top handled saw was a Shitdaiwa 357, dang got tennis elbow from it!

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TrevMcRev

And forearms like popeye!

1st guy i really started climbing for had a couple. The weight is one thing, but the balance terrible. Try tilting one up sideways for a pruning cut at full reach one hand.

Eric Frei

The Japs never thought much about attaching it to a lanyard either!

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stirmantrees

its my thread so i suppose i should let myself get scoffed at. here is a couple examples where i use one hand to cut the limb with.


i have had no formal training with basket work. It has all been learn as you go, common sense mixed with tree knowledge and things like "that limb weighs 800 lbs and i am 65 foot up with the boom all the way extended, if it catches the corner it could spring me out and i would be hitting my head on the bottom of the boom" kind of training. when i get up there in height i seem to be ever so concernd with basket position more then cutting technique(one hand vs. two). i would rather get one more foot of clearance and cut with one hand and grab the basket than snuggle up to the branch and cut with 2.
With the jlg's they have an open basket and when catching a top or a dangerous situation i can actually be above the point of rigging and reach down throught the basket and cut. anyways, that is rare, but i have done that on occasion.
Ofcourse over extending is to be considered when doing basket work as a saw snag could give you a much unwanted yank
what a crazy and dangerous field we perform in. we should all make tons of money

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letigre

haha love this thread. so contentious. like stirman, ive been gradually moving away from exclusive one-handing to very rarely. the 'very rarely' part normally occurs whilst im working in a bucket.

i still step cut timber, because i think it is much better to handle larger wood with two hands for the good of your back and body, but i will quite often onehand brush for production purposes. my reasoning for this is, i can be rescued with ease, as all the groundstaff have to do is bring me down which would literally take a couple of minutes. i know this is still bad practise and i will still step cut a few limbs at once and then put the saw down to crack them off when i get the opportunity, but i feel as tho the comfort of the bucket positioning and ease of rescue lends itself more readily to one-handed chainsaw use.

having said all of that, i almost never use a chainsaw onehanded in a tree. i think its stupid and dangerous. any climber who calls himself so, should be able to get into a position with two points of attachment and two hands on the saw 98% of the time. 1%, time should be taken with a handsaw and the other 1% would be dead trees as has been discussed.

ive cut myself on my left forearm. not through one-handed use. i was putting the saw away across my body (with out the chainbrake on) when the limb i was rigging popped off more aggressively then i anticipated causing me to stick the saw into my arm. luckily it was off and was only just spinning around otherwise i would have lost my arm.

reason why im saying this is to express the rescue element. i was lucky enough to be able to climb down out of the tree. if i could not, the position i was in out on a limb, would have taken forever to get to for a rescuer and i could of bled to death. so having said that i think it is negligent and selfish of a climber to use a chainsaw one-handed unless it is that 1% (and rescue procedures would be inplace).

i saw how much distress i caused my groundstaff from my mistake and i realise that i have to think of more than my own selfishness. i have a gf and a brother that depend on me not to mention my fantastic friends and workmates.

be safe and do it the right way and go home to your families. EVERY DAY.

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Eric Frei

I think all that stretching with one hand from a distant bucket is bad, you really need to work on that.

I see rigging attached to the piece so a slew is likely, so how do you cut the scarf if you're so stretched for a back cut?

Or do you just tear cut everything like the YOBBO's?

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stirmantrees

i can cut a scarf with one hand like that on the underside no problem. sometimes i will make the knotch then move away and reach and cut. sometimes i stay right on it and use 2 hands.
no i dont tear everything, just depends.
what the ? is a YOBBOS ? i may be one
dont tell me and ill take it as a compliment

well if i was closer to the tree i would have to use 2 hands and that would just make to much sense jk

stirmantrees

thanks. i will work on that eric

newguy18

Be nice Eric,tear cuts do have thier place in tree removals and sometimes in pruning,but definatly not on a collar cut.In fact i use them alot on removals,sometimes you need it for slow hinging or to hold and pull with one hand while cutting with the other,it can be quite effective if yuo know how to do it.

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old schooler

Victor Lindsay

So, what you're saying is the targets below, the size, weight, and freshness of the branchs will reduce the hazards that come with one handing the saw? What make one handing that saw so hazardous anyway?

Like I said, I will one hand the saw when cleaning palms, but find it hard to justify with removals or pruning. jm2c

windthrown

I sold all my TH saws. Used to have an Echo CS-3000 and a Stihl 020. No longer. Reason: The tendancy to one-hand a TH saw is just too easy and too tempting. Only a matter of time before something goes wrong, or you wind up with serious tendonitis like I have. I do not climb much any more, but I do not find that I miss the TH saws when I do.

stirmantrees

no, more like i am already in a hazardous situation and cutting smaller pieces rather than larger ones seemes safer sometimes. and i can cut smaller pieces with one hand than i can with 2 hands from the same position(reaching out ofcourse).

I have done many of dead trees (pines especially), that make me limit my movement around the tree because of obvious reasons. and if i can manage smaller pieces, i will. with that said i have on countless occasions used my pole saw aloft. which ofcourse enables the smallest of cuts or the most strategic from the farthest distance. now, when i have to rope the entire dead tree off itself, this, for me, is when i really calculate my rigging point with the weight of the limb and MAYBE using one hand to cut a smaller piece(farther out) is safer than the dangers of using two hands closer???????????

whatever, i never really thought about using one hand till i joined this forum. i know i am thinking about it and beginning to restrict its use a little. maybe you could always get into a safe as position and cut with 2 hands. if i had to say i would say that sometimes(albeit rarely) your positioning can be safer/better where you reach out with one hand.

so you say palms are an example of when it is justifiable to cut with one hand?

stirmantrees

that is prob. the best cure for onehandcutitis of which i have a bad case of.

jomoco

Well like a few other posts here mentioned, one handing a top handle trim saw simply becomes part of your method and style of removing or trimming trees, that the idea of changing that speed enhancing habit becomes something to chuckle about and not take seriously at all, particularly after having done it for 36 years!

The primary reason for it is control over what your cutting off the tree without ropes. Be it green palm fronds, heavy fruit stalks or smaller branches in a hardwood tree, using one hand to catch it and the other to cut it becomes second nature. In my case it started at age 14 with an 8 inch Montgomery Wards electric chainsaw to prune SoCal Wash fans in 1973.

As long as you have the strength of grip and a provenly safe methodology of when and why to do it, it becomes an integral function of how you take down or prune modestly strategic trees that would otherwise require roping, more time, and therefore more money.

Even sometimes when I am roping, say catching a whole leader head and going for a moderate ride. Rather than trying to time chucking my saw onto it's lanyard or clipping it back onto my saddle before I brace myself for the ride, I'll just use my thumb to turn it off, hold on to it with one hand, and straight arm the wood in front of me with the other during the ride, the heavy sawhand can actually help you keep your balance during the ride.

Obviously there are many situations that demand a two handed grip on a top handle saw or any other, but to insist one handing not be recognised as a pro's legitimate option or style, is a pompous denial of reality in my opinion.

For me it started in fan palms at an early age and never stopped as I progressed into big hardwoods. And if more of you blokes were honest, you'd admit you've one handed rear triggered medium saws bombing down spars that need to go in a specific spot below.

I like honesty in threads as much as anyone, and the resulting squeals of indignation it prompts from the safety nazis so in vogue at some websites these days.

Having said all that, I firmly believe that sketchy cut with one hand and catch with the other situations, are best done with a razor sharp modern handsaw. Many times I'll cut my face and start my finish with a trim saw, then hook it to my saddle and actually finish the cut with my handsaw.

I'm very fond of brushing semi-strategic trees with a handsaw and only using the chainsaw for the wood, it saves gas and provides more control in certain situations.

Do I one hand my top handle trimsaw everytime I cut down a tree? Almost invariably. Do I recommend other climbers do the same? No.

What ever floats your boat is fine by me mates!

Interesting thread.

jomoco

Eric Frei

LOL, we only have 1 never vote.

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stirmantrees

just as i suspected.
and it comes prob. from the one who truly uses two hands. the one who sold his top handle saws and states honestly why he did it.....so he wouldnt use one hand.

i appreciate honesty.

stirmantrees

excellent, well thought out feedback

i need to get a better handsaw. all i have is an old zubat. not very aggressive cutter thats for sure. i do use hyauchis like a crack addict

newguy18

It seems every time i use a 200t every cut is one handed,in palms espically trimming palms off a ladder i just start it,with one hand go around the palm and done in like 2 minutes,since we usually trim sabals and washys at 10 and 2,quick more efficent and i keep going.

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old schooler

Bruce Hopf

I used to use one of my McCulloch Mini Mac chain saws, along with a piece of lumber, to measure how long I wanted to cut my blocks of fire wood. I would just place the bar, and chain to just put a cut about a half an inch deep.
If I was doing limb work, I'd mark my cut, hold onto the chain saw with both hands, and finish the cut. Now I have a rig set up on my chain saw to do the measuring, while operating the chain saw with both hands. Bruce.

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1- Pro Mac 10-10, 1- Mac Cat, 2- Eager Beaver
2.0's, 1- Mac 1-10
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Stand Back, I Have A Very Extreme Case of CAD (Chain Saw Addiction Disorder).

dov

Personally it depends what I'm doing. I often carry a handsaw up a tree with me, as well as a pair of secateurs in the back pocket.

I have a little Echo 350TES with a 14" bar as my primary climbing saw. Nicely balanced and versatile. I often use one hand to steady my position in the tree and one to wield the saw with the following exceptions: where the cut is more than 4" or done using the outer half of the bar I generally use both hands and also if there are twigs/other branches very close to the cut. I've known a couple of times how quickly the chainsaw can kick when even a tiny branch touches the tip during a cut.

On the ground while processing I tend to use the saw one handed most of the time.

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