One Handed Chainsawing

Streyken

I?ve seen huge debates on the web regarding one handed chainsaw use and am curious how one could do certain jobs without one handing it. How can a climber cut a branch and place it where he wants with both hands on the saw? If you say rope, my question then is how can you remove 200 + branches from a tree in less than an hour using a rope? I?ve been at this a fair while now and when I hear someone say don?t cut one handed I immediately think someone has just read their first safety manual or has retired and is now teaching safety.

Funny how when you?re not doing this job on a production level your outlook changes. I removed three trees today and every single cut was one handed, either with my left or right whichever was fastest. Maybe I?ve just been lucky for the past 18 years.

I have yet to see a climber in my area who doesn?t cut on handed.

I?m curious as to your guys take on this. Anyone who hasn?t been climbing commercially with a saw for at least a few years need not answer; your opinion doesn?t matter to me with regards to this particular topic.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

Eric Frei

Hahaha

I wonder how many will tell the truth?

I wonder how many will cover their ass?

I wonder how many aren't faced with the problem because the trees they cut aren't the same allowing drops and rig offs of suitable proportion ... like a euc say, rig off large branches, then the top, flop the barrel.

However, you have Doug Firs ... we have this Cook pine, similar to a Norfolk pine but lot more branches lot smaller, same sort of deal.

Then we have palms, lot of fronds that are above shoulder ht in most cases to cut as you're going up the pole.

This question will be answered cautiously ... many opting for the silent approach I say.

An anonymous poll would be best but it still wont change what you, I or Grover does.

__________________

Streyken

Okay. What will the responses be?
Mine are:
I cut one handed all the time, just because I can
I cut one handed when need arises
I never cut one handed and I’m a liar
I never cut one handed because I don’t use a saw

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

jim1nz

I use rigging gear and its slower, i use a hand saw and its slower, i use a chainsaw two handed and.....

Im honest.

__________________
SPEED ALWAYS FOLLOWS TECHNIQUE

Eric Frei

__________________

Streyken

This has to depend on the type of trees you do. Here if you rigged or used a hand saw to remove 200' of branches with an average diameter of 3"-4" and you'd be on the job for days, but only able to charge for one day.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

Sean Freeman

I try very hard to two hand the climbing saw, but there are many times in the tree and palm that I one hand the saw. As you say Streyken it comes about mostly from trying to get the job done quickly, there is more risk envolved, and there are (nearly) always other ways of making the cut two handed.
Step or snap cutting is often a safer method in tree and palm but it does slow you down, as I'm writing this the words of the forestry examiner who trained us in advanced manual felling (production) are ringing in my ears...he taught myself Tim and Steve the split back cut (or quarter cut) the safest felling method there is. He would have no time for my excuses for choosing speed over safety.

Jeff Darby

We use two hands on the saw all the time honest dame snoz allways gives me up!.

__________________

Member: Australian Tree Association

Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard !

Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others

© Jeffrey J Darby 2011

TrevMcRev

Mmmm....

Always an interesting topic this one.

I think the real danger with 1 handing comes from not knowing when it is really dangerous. I've seen climbers put themself at huge risk doing this without knowing it, thinking all is fine. To me, there's an acceptable time to do it and and an unacceptable time to do it. (One is when worksafe come by )

Seriously, cutting a branch you dont need to hold is usually ok. I think cutting a left facing lateral holding the branch with your left hand and cutting with the right or a total vice versa of this is usually ok.

Its when you cross over, or cut vertical branches/stems that you face the massively increased risk of cutting yourself when the falling weight of a branch maybe in the wrong direction drags your arm across the saw.

This is the time to either rope it, step cut/snap/throw it, or sometimes i attach a sling and hold it to bring my arm/hand well away from the saw.

But those that just cut away at anything with 1 hand just coz ya can with a tophandle saw are asking for it. These people are the ones behind the injuries that are so common in this industry. If you work like this its just a matter of time before it happens.

Eric Frei

I think it's also damned dangerous when new/shy/inexperience/uncertain/worried person starts the cut with the saw at low revs ... enter that cut with a screaming saw, full pelt, so it cuts not slides or bogs etc.

__________________

TreeCo

I use both hands on my 200T chainsaw 75% of the time. The percentage varies depending on the type of tree work I'm doing. For saws larger than the 200T I almost always use two hands.

George Hayduke

Rarely do I ever one-hand. The risk is too great. It rarely takes longer in the tree to use two hands. The more that you do that the more likely you are to get cut. Russian roulette...

matty f

I use saws one handed quite alot like when if your stretchin for a limb to do a step cut on a reducion i put the saw down reach out and break it off.unless like monday when it was way to windy and every thing had to be held and cut or roped...but thats pretty rare.
some times ill make 4 step cuts on differnt branches put the saw down and snap off each branch individually and chuck them in the target zone,speeds thing up a bit!

Streyken

Again, it must depend on what type of tree you're doing. I have a large hemlock to do soon with hundreds of branches. Figure 200 branches in one tree X 30 seconds a branch extra = lots of time. And that's only one tree. You'd never get any work and or make money here if you roped everything down.

I'm not talking about recklessly swinging the saw out of control either; I've never come close to cutting myself in the last 18 years by cutting branches one-handed.

<edit>And snap cuts don't work here on Douglas-fir or alder - the branches will pop off as soon as you touch the tension wood.</edit>

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

Jeff Darby

I think this post represents an honest experienced reply.

not wanting to offend,just think honestly about how you use your saws,what saw for what job,repositioning for greater control while cutting,and if you answer honestly,..TreeCo hits me as doing this..regardless of ridcule.

__________________

Member: Australian Tree Association

Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard !

Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others

© Jeffrey J Darby 2011

Streyken

TrevMcRev, your observation regarding tophandle saws is right on, very easy to get complacent with one of these in my opinion. I know many climbers swear by them, but I tried one for a week, just to give it a fair shake, and that was it. I could see getting cut by one of these very easily. Maybe I just needed to give it more time though.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

JohN Dee

For my climber saws I would say the same for myself as what TreeCo said, about 75% of the time I use two hands, but in that 25% of the time I don't I watch exactly what I'm cutting and how it is going to react with my bar and chain and tend to keep it as far away from my body as possible.

As for the other saws I work with 99% of the times both my hands are on that saw.

It is very important to know your saw, bar and chain and how they are going to react with every cut you put in. The minute you under estimate it or become compacant it's gunna whack you good.

__________________
We are what we repeatedly do... Excellence then, is not an act, but HABIT...

Red : Green : Blue

Eric Frei

Steyken

What sort of saw you one handing? A rear handled saw? Wouldn't that be worse than a top handled?

__________________

Streyken

I use an ms260 with 18" bar. I just didn't like the pivot point of the tophandle. With the larger saw I'm also not tempted to swing it straight arm.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

Eric Frei

We need to see video of how you do it, both LH and RH.

__________________

Streyken

I'll try to get some next week. I did play camera man today and got a bit of video of double blocking, I'll upload and start another thread.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

Eric Frei

Be good to keep all your stuff together.

Here's another thread similar topic.

Double Block Bucking

Any other threads add the link here and vice versa.

__________________

TrueBlacktopp

one handed saws don't have enough power to do the job in BC you need something with a bit more jam to cut thought those branches fast. i work for a Vancouver and area company and not a single person in the company uses a one handed saw

Streyken

I only know a few people that use a tophandle saw. Most here use the Husky 346 or Stihl 260. It wasn't the power difference that put me off, I just didn't like the feeling of the pivot point, but as I said, I only tried one for a week. I also didn't like the short bar.

__________________

Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all...
but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

yooper

Im a one handed bandit!!! but try to use 2 as much as possible

Tree Machine

I have to side with that one. I know everyone raves about the MS200T, but I pick one of those up and it feels like a toy.

I gave up on top-handles a few years ago because of three reasons:
1) They tend to encourage one-handing, by virture of their design.
2) They run out of gas too fast.
3) The power just ain't there.

I grew tired of the shoulder and wrist problems associated with one-handing and moved up to something with more power whose design sort of required a two-handed approach.

The weight of a middleweight saw compared to a top-handle is not that much different, speaking from a practical standpoint.

I've gotten so used to to the saw sinking through the wood like softened butter that it would be a backwards step in production and efficiency if I went back to a top-handle. I wait for a top-handle to get through the wood. With a little bigger saw, more cutting per tank of gas and the cutting is faster and no need to swap saws when the wood gets bigger (up to 12 or 14").

I take a great deal of pride in swiftly and efficiently getting into a proper cutting position. If you're in good position, one-handing is a choice, not a necessity. Still, there are times, I one-hand, but usually only when the cutting is below me.

TrevMcRev

For me it depends on the style of job at hand.
For Crown Reduction Pruning, reaching out to 2" dia tips, a top handle saw & Silky zubat is preffered, but have done it with a 2 handle when at a pinch.

For smallish removals with lots of cut/snap/throw a top handle is preffered.

For med/large removals with either open space or rigging a grunty 2 handle is good, i'm happy to do it but often forget out of habit unless its real big.

Most other climbers ive seen would never even think about using anything other than their ms200 no matter how big the job and will push it to its limits on cuts well & truly big enough they should have moved up a saw size.

BTW, when i say 2 handle i know ms200 has 2 handles as well! I mean a conventional handled saw!

TrevMcRev

TM, you use a husky dont you?
What would be it's comparable cousin amongst the stihl range?
Not to familiar with huskys model range.

Tree Machine

It's a 46 cc machine (346XP), so whatever in the Stihl range is somewhere in the mid-40 cc range.

I tried something different about 16 months ago, I removed the .325 7-pin sprocket and changed it over to a .375 (3/8) 8-pin. Then I went from a 16" 3/8 .058 bar to a 14" titanium carving bar and the 3/8 low-profile mini-chain. Now I have a smaller, lighter bar, thinner kerf chain with the bigger powerhead. Having had the exhaust modded really helped the low-end grunt, so all together the thing performs like a dream saw. The very best thing of all..... the chain NEVER flips off. I would think this to be impossible, but 16 months, never had the chain fly off even once.

I don't even believe my own self, reading that line, but it's just one of those things, unexpected, but dearly appreciated.

The titanium wears really well, too. Still on the original first bar, and probably the 30th chain. Never have dressed it, only cleaned out the rail and holes.

TrueBlacktopp

I think that top handle saw have there place and use but dont need to be used everyday, in a bucket where lots of times you will grab your wood to drop it, i think it would be safer to use a top handle saw then to one handle a normal saw like what most guys do at my work, but hey that my thoughts