One Handed Chainsawing

Tree Machine · 28th May 2007, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrueBlacktopp

one handed saws don't have enough power to do the job in BC you need something with a bit more jam to cut thought those branches fast.

I have to side with that one. I know everyone raves about the MS200T, but I pick one of those up and it feels like a toy.

I gave up on top-handles a few years ago because of three reasons:
1) They tend to encourage one-handing, by virture of their design.
2) They run out of gas too fast.
3) The power just ain't there.

I grew tired of the shoulder and wrist problems associated with one-handing and moved up to something with more power whose design sort of required a two-handed approach.

The weight of a middleweight saw compared to a top-handle is not that much different, speaking from a practical standpoint.

I've gotten so used to to the saw sinking through the wood like softened butter that it would be a backwards step in production and efficiency if I went back to a top-handle. I wait for a top-handle to get through the wood. With a little bigger saw, more cutting per tank of gas and the cutting is faster and no need to swap saws when the wood gets bigger (up to 12 or 14").

I take a great deal of pride in swiftly and efficiently getting into a proper cutting position. If you're in good position, one-handing is a choice, not a necessity. Still, there are times, I one-hand, but usually only when the cutting is below me.

TrevMcRev · 28th May 2007, 05:00 PM

For me it depends on the style of job at hand.
For Crown Reduction Pruning, reaching out to 2" dia tips, a top handle saw & Silky zubat is preffered, but have done it with a 2 handle when at a pinch.

For smallish removals with lots of cut/snap/throw a top handle is preffered.

For med/large removals with either open space or rigging a grunty 2 handle is good, i'm happy to do it but often forget out of habit unless its real big.

Most other climbers ive seen would never even think about using anything other than their ms200 no matter how big the job and will push it to its limits on cuts well & truly big enough they should have moved up a saw size.

BTW, when i say 2 handle i know ms200 has 2 handles as well! I mean a conventional handled saw!

TrevMcRev · 28th May 2007, 05:02 PM

TM, you use a husky dont you?
What would be it's comparable cousin amongst the stihl range?
Not to familiar with huskys model range.

Tree Machine · 28th May 2007, 05:17 PM

It's a 46 cc machine (346XP), so whatever in the Stihl range is somewhere in the mid-40 cc range.

I tried something different about 16 months ago, I removed the .325 7-pin sprocket and changed it over to a .375 (3/8) 8-pin. Then I went from a 16" 3/8 .058 bar to a 14" titanium carving bar and the 3/8 low-profile mini-chain. Now I have a smaller, lighter bar, thinner kerf chain with the bigger powerhead. Having had the exhaust modded really helped the low-end grunt, so all together the thing performs like a dream saw. The very best thing of all..... the chain NEVER flips off. I would think this to be impossible, but 16 months, never had the chain fly off even once.

I don't even believe my own self, reading that line, but it's just one of those things, unexpected, but dearly appreciated.

The titanium wears really well, too. Still on the original first bar, and probably the 30th chain. Never have dressed it, only cleaned out the rail and holes.

TrueBlacktopp · 28th May 2007, 06:44 PM

I think that top handle saw have there place and use but dont need to be used everyday, in a bucket where lots of times you will grab your wood to drop it, i think it would be safer to use a top handle saw then to one handle a normal saw like what most guys do at my work, but hey that my thoughts

TrueBlacktopp · 28th May 2007, 06:48 PM

tree machine after reading your post i think im gonna try to do that to my 346xp that i got, iv wanted to do it for a while and now hearing your good reviews i think i should

JohN Dee · 28th May 2007, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trev

For me it depends on the style of job at hand.
For Crown Reduction Pruning, reaching out to 2" dia tips, a top handle saw & Silky zubat is preffered, but have done it with a 2 handle when at a pinch.

For smallish removals with lots of cut/snap/throw a top handle is preffered.

For med/large removals with either open space or rigging a grunty 2 handle is good, i'm happy to do it but often forget out of habit unless its real big.

Most other climbers ive seen would never even think about using anything other than their ms200 no matter how big the job and will push it to its limits on cuts well & truly big enough they should have moved up a saw size.

BTW, when i say 2 handle i know ms200 has 2 handles as well! I mean a conventional handled saw!

I'm kinda the same as what you mentioned Trev. Although say about 6-9 months ago I would've been definately Top handle FTW. As of lately with my palm TD's I take out the head with my MS200 and prefer my 250 with a full chisel chain on it for chunking down the palm. I've noticed there is HUGE difference with palm compression wood when I go from the 200 to the 250.

Trev, the conversion to still from the 346xp would be the 250 or 260. The 250 is 45cc's and I'm unsure of the 260's cc's but I'm sure Streyken will be here posting soon enough

.

TrevMcRev · 29th May 2007, 12:20 AM

Just did a quick search for comparison sake.

cc Kw Kg
Stihl 250 45.4 2.3 4.6
Stihl 260 48.7 2.6 4.7
Hus.346xp 45.0 2.5 4.8

So power to weight the 260 is in front. This is the model small saw ive normally used. Have 2 retired parts saws under the bench and due for a newie

The small/light bar/chain mod sounds real good too

Ekka · 29th May 2007, 02:12 AM

Yo guy's

Listen up.

MS250 is a whacko saw for the odd numbered Stihl cheapo series. It's genetically a misfit for the home-owner crap saws. It does not comply with the 290, 310, 390 garbage.

This is what I do. Take off the front of the muffler and remove the gauze, put front of muffler back on. (real easy)

Get a screw driver in the rectangular vents of the front muffler and twist them open heaps wider. (better breathing)

Now piss the 325 chain crap off and replace with 375 picco chain and 16" bar (same as 200T chain, change drive sprocket/drum assy to 375 picco).

Retune.

Now this baby goes better than a 26, wont corrode from palm crud, weighs much less than a 26 and costs much less. Everyone who worked here loves it, everyone. And it vibrates less and has more balls than some 26 POS!

Yeah, I make a statement, that 26 is a sluggish dog.

And vibrates harder than Bert Newtons pace maker.

TrevMcRev · 29th May 2007, 03:30 AM

Ok, might look at doing a hotted up 25 then.

Admitidly, the current 026's are gutless compared to one old one i had from about 10 yrs ago and was 2nd hand then. It had bags of grunt and revved way harder but sweetly too. Then i got a new second one and nobody wanted to use it coz it was gutless compared to the old banger. Now they're both basket cases.

But you gotta wonder, what would a 26 do with the same mods?

Ekka · 29th May 2007, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrevMcRev

But you gotta wonder, what would a 26 do with the same mods?

Who cares, they're crap!

pomme · 29th May 2007, 03:54 PM

streyken your right i have also been in this industry for 18 years and there are times when you need to use the saw one handed. has anyone tried the sawproof gauntlets?

Ekka · 29th May 2007, 09:48 PM

But if you are sawing through a limb one handed with a rear handled saw (ms260, 345husky etc) wouldn't the saw fall downwards as you exit the cut?

Streyken · 29th May 2007, 10:46 PM

I'll have to grab some video when I get a suitable tree. For my application (mainly conifers with straight branches), I'd say I have more control with a rear handled saw. On removals you can flush-cut at a slight angle toward the trunk. Or there are a number of ways to hold the saw exactly where you want it, but I?ll get video, just thinking about it I can?t explain exactly.

NeTree · 21st June 2007, 01:31 PM

I (use to) one-hand my top-handle saw all the time.

In the real world, a) that's what they're made for and b) it's faster, and fast is money.

Can't say I've ever felt unsafe doing it- then, I'm well mindful that I AM only one-handing it.

JM2C

mrrecurve · 25th June 2007, 05:12 PM

Top handled saws are designed to be used with one hand.

I think it is an entirely appropriate practice when required. Having said that, I do two hand the saw where applicable.

newguy18 · 26th June 2007, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Hayduke

Rarely do I ever one-hand. The risk is too great. It rarely takes longer in the tree to use two hands. The more that you do that the more likely you are to get cut. Russian roulette...

I one hand my 141 50 percent of the time.If you guys could see some of the trees in my area you would see why.No i don't cut commercially all the time but i do it enough to where i took a year to get a thorough knowledge of thr trees in my area,learn basic cutting techniques on the ground,and got about a year of climbing with the gear not useing it before i decided i was ready.Since then i have only done a few trees but you got to give me credit for taking the time to learn proper pruning cuts and tree care.

28th May 2007, 05:00 PM	#27 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 732	For me it depends on the style of job at hand. For Crown Reduction Pruning, reaching out to 2" dia tips, a top handle saw & Silky zubat is preffered, but have done it with a 2 handle when at a pinch. For smallish removals with lots of cut/snap/throw a top handle is preffered. For med/large removals with either open space or rigging a grunty 2 handle is good, i'm happy to do it but often forget out of habit unless its real big. Most other climbers ive seen would never even think about using anything other than their ms200 no matter how big the job and will push it to its limits on cuts well & truly big enough they should have moved up a saw size. BTW, when i say 2 handle i know ms200 has 2 handles as well! I mean a conventional handled saw! __________________ Melbourne Arborist, Total Tree Care, Pruning, Tree and Stump Removal

28th May 2007, 05:02 PM	#28 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 732	TM, you use a husky dont you? What would be it's comparable cousin amongst the stihl range? Not to familiar with huskys model range. __________________ Melbourne Arborist, Total Tree Care, Pruning, Tree and Stump Removal

29th May 2007, 12:20 AM	#33 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 732	Just did a quick search for comparison sake. cc Kw Kg Stihl 250 45.4 2.3 4.6 Stihl 260 48.7 2.6 4.7 Hus.346xp 45.0 2.5 4.8 So power to weight the 260 is in front. This is the model small saw ive normally used. Have 2 retired parts saws under the bench and due for a newie The small/light bar/chain mod sounds real good too __________________ Melbourne Arborist, Total Tree Care, Pruning, Tree and Stump Removal

29th May 2007, 02:12 AM	#34 (permalink)
Ekka Eric Frei Administrator - Brisbane L5 (Dip) Hort Cert III Arb + some Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 6,606	Yo guy's Listen up. MS250 is a whacko saw for the odd numbered Stihl cheapo series. It's genetically a misfit for the home-owner crap saws. It does not comply with the 290, 310, 390 garbage. This is what I do. Take off the front of the muffler and remove the gauze, put front of muffler back on. (real easy) Get a screw driver in the rectangular vents of the front muffler and twist them open heaps wider. (better breathing) Now piss the 325 chain crap off and replace with 375 picco chain and 16" bar (same as 200T chain, change drive sprocket/drum assy to 375 picco). Retune. Now this baby goes better than a 26, wont corrode from palm crud, weighs much less than a 26 and costs much less. Everyone who worked here loves it, everyone. And it vibrates less and has more balls than some 26 POS! Yeah, I make a statement, that 26 is a sluggish dog. And vibrates harder than Bert Newtons pace maker. __________________ Remember to use the "search" function, if you have answers/questions post them so everyone can benefit. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping Brisbane Tree Care, Consultations and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

29th May 2007, 03:30 AM	#35 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 732	Ok, might look at doing a hotted up 25 then. Admitidly, the current 026's are gutless compared to one old one i had from about 10 yrs ago and was 2nd hand then. It had bags of grunt and revved way harder but sweetly too. Then i got a new second one and nobody wanted to use it coz it was gutless compared to the old banger. Now they're both basket cases. But you gotta wonder, what would a 26 do with the same mods? __________________ Melbourne Arborist, Total Tree Care, Pruning, Tree and Stump Removal

28th May 2007, 05:17 PM	#29 (permalink)
Tree Machine Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 569	It's a 46 cc machine (346XP), so whatever in the Stihl range is somewhere in the mid-40 cc range. I tried something different about 16 months ago, I removed the .325 7-pin sprocket and changed it over to a .375 (3/8) 8-pin. Then I went from a 16" 3/8 .058 bar to a 14" titanium carving bar and the 3/8 low-profile mini-chain. Now I have a smaller, lighter bar, thinner kerf chain with the bigger powerhead. Having had the exhaust modded really helped the low-end grunt, so all together the thing performs like a dream saw. The very best thing of all..... the chain NEVER flips off. I would think this to be impossible, but 16 months, never had the chain fly off even once. I don't even believe my own self, reading that line, but it's just one of those things, unexpected, but dearly appreciated. The titanium wears really well, too. Still on the original first bar, and probably the 30th chain. Never have dressed it, only cleaned out the rail and holes.

28th May 2007, 06:44 PM	#30 (permalink)
TrueBlacktopp Sappling Join Date: May 2007 Location: White Rock, bc Posts: 9	I think that top handle saw have there place and use but dont need to be used everyday, in a bucket where lots of times you will grab your wood to drop it, i think it would be safer to use a top handle saw then to one handle a normal saw like what most guys do at my work, but hey that my thoughts

28th May 2007, 06:48 PM	#31 (permalink)
TrueBlacktopp Sappling Join Date: May 2007 Location: White Rock, bc Posts: 9	tree machine after reading your post i think im gonna try to do that to my 346xp that i got, iv wanted to do it for a while and now hearing your good reviews i think i should

29th May 2007, 03:54 PM	#37 (permalink)
pomme Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: england Posts: 218	streyken your right i have also been in this industry for 18 years and there are times when you need to use the saw one handed. has anyone tried the sawproof gauntlets?

29th May 2007, 09:48 PM	#38 (permalink)
Ekka Eric Frei Administrator - Brisbane L5 (Dip) Hort Cert III Arb + some Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 6,606	But if you are sawing through a limb one handed with a rear handled saw (ms260, 345husky etc) wouldn't the saw fall downwards as you exit the cut? __________________ Remember to use the "search" function, if you have answers/questions post them so everyone can benefit. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping Brisbane Tree Care, Consultations and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

29th May 2007, 10:46 PM	#39 (permalink)
Streyken Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 205	I'll have to grab some video when I get a suitable tree. For my application (mainly conifers with straight branches), I'd say I have more control with a rear handled saw. On removals you can flush-cut at a slight angle toward the trunk. Or there are a number of ways to hold the saw exactly where you want it, but I?ll get video, just thinking about it I can?t explain exactly. __________________ Trimmin' bush and caring for flowers is good 'n' all... but sometimes ya gotta let the big wood fly and pound the garden.

21st June 2007, 01:31 PM	#40 (permalink)
NeTree Sappling Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: USA Posts: 11	I (use to) one-hand my top-handle saw all the time. In the real world, a) that's what they're made for and b) it's faster, and fast is money. Can't say I've ever felt unsafe doing it- then, I'm well mindful that I AM only one-handing it. JM2C

25th June 2007, 05:12 PM	#41 (permalink)
mrrecurve Banned Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 4	Top handled saws are designed to be used with one hand. I think it is an entirely appropriate practice when required. Having said that, I do two hand the saw where applicable.