I.S.A. members ,certified arborist,and well everybody

osb_mail

Hey I was just wondering how everyone thought about I.S.A big annual trade show and meeting what are your thoughts . Why the hell does it cost a I.S.A member $395.00 dollars to go to there own conference . I know they have to rent the place out pay speakers (I think speakers get paid )$395 dollars plus 100 dollars to be a member oh yeah plus 40 dollars chapter dues .I don t see A problem with a fee but come on . Is it really worth it . Just would like to know what others thought . Maybe ISA should just take a percentage of what everyone makes each year . Just think if you had like 10 workers you wanted to send to the meeting . I think these meeting trade shows are great for tree care but not if no one can afford only big business .I would like to think ISA is a stand up organistion but they seem kind of like giant money monster that always needs feed .I am wrong please correct me . I have never herd ISA do anything in my community .I understand I dont really live in big city . Maybe someone on this site can help so I can start writing those checks again for ISA

Eric Frei

Is anyone going to publish their financials?

Lets see total revenue/expenses by category.

I think the President and officialdom are either volunteers or low paid, but correct me if I am wrong.

So, apparently members have access to the financials, lets see them. They are an org and that information is public.

I saw a funny little thing on an orgs website that said their a non profit organisation .... never read a bigger lie in my life.

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osb_mail

I am with you Ekka I dont really want to bad mouth ISA because I am pretty sure it is about all we have. Ohio chapter seems to be a joke other than pretty good 2 a year meetings that are again over priced to look Ohio chapter website what a joke well at least they got some pictures of meeting from 4 years ago .Ohio Chapter of the ISA

osb_mail

also website says Last revised August 13, 2003.

Eric Frei

Lets see financials though, I've been asking for them for years now but their loyal subjects are sworn to secrecy perhaps.

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osb_mail

I am not sure if thuis would help you buy this is the Finance Committee email dscharf@wachteltree.com maybe you could send him a email

osb_mail

I am not a member anymore .Well at least until I get a little better understanding of these guys .

treeseer

osb did you even go to the chapter meeting this year? It did not look overpriced to me. I gave 3 talks there and met some very cool arborists. It seems like a very strong chapter to me.What I liked was they held the meeting in an affordable hotel and did not go for the lavish spread that drives costs up.

The array of vendors was phenomenal--lots of good gear and products. You don't know how good you got it with that chapter.

re the Intl meeting, I have some of the same problem as you with the cost and the tilt toward the expense account crowd, but they are the ones who attend in great numbers so their desires get met. I just write the check and dive in and get involved (volunteer ~20 hrs/month) and get a whole lot out of that investment.

Like you say, what else is there, as a vehicle to keep up with and move the industry? St. Louis will be good--I'm going there friday to prep my preconference workshop. I got 6 facilitators to volunteer to lead small group discussions and I will make it as good as I can.

Stay home and spend your money elsewhere if you choose. But go thru their website first before you decide on membership--they do a lot of good.

osb_mail

Ohio conference cost for members 250 dollars non member 310 . last year I think they had about 15 vendors tops 2 gear vendors .No I did not go this year could not afford I wanted too but did not have $310 dollars to spend .

Bermy

At least you have conferences to go to in your country, and gear stores you can drive to....oops I forgot your gas has gone up to $3...
Try buying a plane ticket on top of all the other fees...or paying $7 a gallon for gas...

ISA and TCIA and Arb Association may be pricey (I'm a member of all of them), and have their faults but for those of us who live in out of the way places with no local standards, training or education opportunities, they are a lifeline, magazines, websites, contacts, publications. I'm starting my conference saving account, which one I go to will depend on what else I can accomplish in the same area to maximize my $$$'s.

I also find these forums an extremely valuable resource, free (except for the time you spend) and many of the issues raised in trade articles get hashed out here, discussed and dissected, as we say...It's all good!

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Keep smiling, people will wonder what you are up to! (especially if you're gunning a chainsaw!)

Tree Machine

Bermy, you have the right perspective. And so do you, OSB.

OSB, it costs money. Bermy, it cost's you a lot more money.

All of us pay in if we choose to support our industry leadership. Some companies are large and have budgets, but Arborists like Bermy and OSB and Tree Machine, we're small operations.

Tree Machine is a solo operator, occasional help. I pay dues to TCIA ($395) and to ISA Intl. and ISA Indiana chapter dues. I feel it's important to support our industry leadership, and it is my option to use the benefits they provide, and attend the conferences they put on. It is through these organizations that we can gain legitimate, recognized accreditation.You do what you can, OSB. Catch the Conference and Trade Show next time around. And don't feel any guilt about it. If going to an event can sabotage your life, financially or in any way, ya don't do it.

As far as what ISA does with the money, the hard working people there attempt to run the organization like any well-run business; at a profit. this allows our industry leadership to lead in a manner that does not have to scrape by and chintz. We support the organization hosting our professional community so they can facilitate the excange of information through annual conferences, climbing competitions, Expos and a number of monthly publications.

TCIA and ISA are my source of Arboricultural information. Otherwise I'd have to depend on forum sites exclusively.

I would really hate for our respected Treecare Industry to not have leadership. that's why I pay up. But as far as the conferences and Expos themselves, I'm with you, OSB; I go if it fits into the scheme of things.

newguy18

3.50 here and i'm in the middle of nowhere.

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old schooler

rich

Hi osb. I have ISA UK chapter advert from Total Arb magazine here for your comparison. I have been careing for trees for 13 years, last 4 of which at serious and qualified level and have learnt amost everything i know from the more experianced arborist working for and with me and am eternaly gratefull for their time and patience.

For me with still so much to soak up and learn evey piece of info helps so to join ISA is a dead cert for £125 per year...its a bloody bargain man.

2 editions of Tree News, 4 editions of Treeline,6 editions of Total Arb,4 editions of Essential Arb, 2 EAC newsletters, Discounts on events and seminars, Discount card at various suppliers, Free Samurai GC300 pruning saw.

Take advantage of the excellent craft quals' and the personal training and development possible through seminars and simply attending and networking at the TCC's.

Progress through ISA and CAS to the consulting level and eventually when they have a full compliment of commercially applicable skills, members will be a usefull and sought after Tree Consultant in their own right.

Be allowed to use the ISA to help create a viable life long career path.

Qualify for discounts on ISA books, certified exams,international events and conferances.

6 editions of Arborist News, 6 editions of the Arb' Urban Forestry Scientific Journal.

Phew...Sound familiar on your side of pond?

Bermy

2 editions of Tree News, 4 editions of Treeline,6 editions of Total Arb,4 editions of Essential Arb, 2 EAC newsletters, Discounts on events and seminars, Discount card at various suppliers, Free Samurai GC300 pruning saw.

You mean you get that in addition to the Arb News and Scientific Journals?
You're making out like a bandit over there!

For all the good of getting the magazines I have a little pet peeve...
I get all the publications at LEAST a month late...ISA routes my magazines through PANAMA for goodness sake! TCIA is not much better, three weeks late is normal.
I got the February Arborist News and March TCIA magazines on the 31st March...

At least it's sunny and warm here

__________________
Keep smiling, people will wonder what you are up to! (especially if you're gunning a chainsaw!)

treeseer

The AA puts out 18 pubs/year? how do they fill them all?

Bermy that late thing must stink; one good thing is the tci coming out online. here is this month's http://www.treecareindustry.org/PDFs...ril_08-web.pdf

but yes downloading can be a pain, and the feel of the paper makes it more special somehow.

Eric Frei

Guy, I think your link is broken but this one will give you every PDF they got. LOL

www.treecareindustry.org - /PDFs/

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Bermy

Thanks guys... I'm still on drip feed dialup...those files take forever to download...but certainly less than a month!

__________________
Keep smiling, people will wonder what you are up to! (especially if you're gunning a chainsaw!)

Tree Machine

Bermy, this is a major, major point. You're isolated by geography, but many of those in our profession are isolated by themselves. There are new people coming into our industry every day, they don't even know there's an ISA or a TCIA, never been to an Expo or attended a state chapter meeting/conference weekend.

Remember, a lot of folks enter into this industry, simply because they have a pickup truck and a saw (The U.S. of A.)

Isolated by lack of knowing that these Industry leadership resources exist for them. So they go on, spiking up live trees to prune them, making their flush cuts on big limb takeoffs, topping and making general pruning cuts anywhere but at a lateral. These potentially good treeguys can be helped, chances are they feel their talent and think they're doing things right.... Affiliating with the organizations, at the very least, can help get an entering noobie on the right track by getting them the professional information that we participating professionals get, and gives them a place where they can go to mix with us in person at conferences.

I know one young hotshot that thinks all he needs to know comes from the Sherrill Catalog, a fine resource I must admit, but it's just a pixel in our overall industry image.

We're a whole bunch of pixels, I agree 100% that forums are extremely valuable resource, but we are no replacement for our true industry leadership, hopefully we are a funnel to it.

Industry leadership is a much better deal than laws, and regulations and restrictions and rules. Without industry leadership we would all be yahoo tree renegades and I would hate to imagine the state of the trees. WITH industry leadership, we have guidelines, we have a name TREECARE PROFESSIONALS, we have a series of accreditations, like Certified Arbortist, certified treeworker, Board Certified Master Arborist and the like. It gives us direction, goals to strive for, professional credentials to reach for and an existence that can go beyond our hometown and neighborhoods.

And they keep it optional. In other words, you are not forced to join, or forced to participate. It remains volunteer on our part. OSB could choose to not be part of an event and is not penalized in any way. You don't gain the continuing education units (CEU's) to fulfill keeping your Certified Arborist status current, but that detail is made convenient by being able to earn CEU's online.

Membership and participation, really, is a good deal.

Bermy

Got to agree with you TM...if all I did was carry on with the start I got as an apprentice, I'd still be doing flush cuts!

Training and certification are optional here, I happen to offer the only certified training and assessment in tree work practices, Lantra Awards and City & Guilds (both UK) its something I saw as neccessary to do here, there is no excuse for not conducting ourselves as professionals, internet, training, magazines, the library...geography or isolation regardless!

Should be getting my March magazine soon

__________________
Keep smiling, people will wonder what you are up to! (especially if you're gunning a chainsaw!)

treevet

OSB, I hope you did not give up your certification because of disenchantment with tradeshows and conferences. There, as said is so much more than that, that it makes the conferences almost redundant. Sure going to the conferences is a treat and sure it is expensive and often at inopportune times during busy season, but the web site info, and the updated book catalogue (I want them all and have most of them) and the mags from both orgs. These things give current matter. As for the CEU's , I doubt that the top level arborists in our profession struggle to reach the ceu count and then say, whew, made I must take a rest. At that level the reading is enjoyment and not a chore and is done far far beyond any ceu total. I keep a file of my favorite articles in various subjects and constantly update them with better and/or more current matter from mags and periodicals.
This makes for a better compilation than a textbook IMO.

Then as I ve said before, we all meet here for fun and to compare notes and learn at the same time. Just like playing basketball or whatever you enjoy indirectly and unconsciously gives conditioning at the same time with little discomfort.

osb_mail

Hey tree vet do you to any ohio isa meeting if so maybe I will go to the next to meet you I have only been 2 of them .They were both fun, educational and over priced .

treevet

Went to the summer one at Ohio state was kinda good. They did a walk about with Boggs and some other entomologist. Eats were good, classes mediocre.
Victor Merrillo, guy wrote 2 trees and the law books was there. Good books but a snoozer of a seminar. Like to think I could get away. PM me if you are going to go and we ll hook up. It'd be fun.

osb_mail

I was at the summer meeting it was fun. I will probably go to the one this summer .If I have the extra time and cash .That Victor was though on the people in that class I did not dare raise my hand do to fear of harassment .

treeseer

Merullo spoke to the ASCA consultants last December. I thought the "Concepts" he kept pushing were just his opinions; he had little to back them up with.

O and if you want to spend a lot to get very little, join ASCA. $365/year for 4 newsletters and little else. Their meetings cost double what ISA's do.

As for Ohio, you missed at least 3 good talks in February, and a good hockey game too.

Tree Machine

In addition to the TCIA Magazine, membership gets you these additional publications.



This one tells me TCIA offers benefits and services that I am not even aware of.

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Tree Machine

Two other publication they send, one is the Equipment Locator. Another very helpful mag is the
Buyer's Guide.

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Tree Machine

Here's a nugget of gold I discovered in there...


I've read so much from Dr. Shigo, but know very little about the man himself. This DVD, just reading the description, fills a gap in my library. If not for my membership, there's a chance I'd have missed this one.

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treeseer

And there is always Expo...Milwaukee isn't too far; you gonna get there Jim?

Bermy

So before when I posted here I said how much membership in professional organizations is important to those of us in isolated areas, isolated in the sense of having minimal direct contact with other industry professionals, and/or seminars, meetings, get togethers and trade shows. I still hold that to be true.

That being said, it is getting very tedious in that it takes well over a month for said organizations magazines to get here! The very item that I want and need!
It is now May 2nd, I have YET to get TCIA for April, ISA Scientific Journal for March or ISA Arborist News for April!

When I have asked questions, the reason I get it that the mail is sent by a bulk mail service...not their fault...cop out!! The International member is getting a raw deal here!
TCIA membership is $318 per year...that makes their magazine $26.50 per issue, it doesn't cost them anything much to email the Reporter and Tree Worker, (I did ask for hard copies but they are not available).
The members discounts on resources, books and merchandise are nice, but I still pay over and above my membership to buy them...for the amount I would save with a members discount, I can buy a lot of books for the $$ I'm putting out in membership.

OK, had a rant, I'll send another email to the respective organizations, the little people are falling through the cracks!

__________________
Keep smiling, people will wonder what you are up to! (especially if you're gunning a chainsaw!)

Tree Machine

The little people are the body of the organization. I think the nerve center needs a poke.

Up front in the TCIA mag are the names of all the board members, their e-mails and phone numbers.

I would be glad to drop a friendly e-mail on behalf of my little people friend in Bermuda. Waiting a month is just not reasonable. I just got the credit card bill for my membership, $394. I payed that willfully and I'll ask if they would be willing to scrape a bit of that off to cover any additional cost to expedite the monthly copy to you.

If you were NOT a member, they would send it out free, and it would cost them just as much and it would get there in the same time it does now. As a paying member I just think they should skip the bulk system and just get it there to you, like for the rest of us.

Yes?

This is the only complaint I've had with TCIA in 14 years, and it's not really even my complaint!
I attended the Milwaukee Expo last time it was in Milwaukee, and just had a blast. Met Mike Maas, JP Sanborn, Nickrosis. There's a good chance, Treeseer.