Angled back cut| backcut| tree felling| back cuts

newguy18 · 18th April 2009, 01:15 PM

Just seems easier for me to place a humboldt cut when taking a top out.

HolmenTree · 19th April 2009, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Just seems easier for me to place a humboldt cut when taking a top out.

X2, humbolt topping a excurrent[conifer for example] for sure. As the top goes over and the hingewood breaks when the notch is closed there is less chance of the top going off track sideways or the butt kicking back.
Also a 45 degree notch is better then a 90 "V" notch while topping , when the 45 closes and the hinge breaks the top sails out from the tree for a little better control and usually lands flat.

newguy18 · 19th April 2009, 10:02 AM

Its just what i've always done,no real reason behind it.

Grais · 19th April 2009, 02:16 PM

Thanks Ekka.
Why oh why do people try to explain away their outdated and dangerous techniques, thank you for putting so succinctly the reasons not too make such a sloppy and unprofessional cut.
Every reason I have heard FOR using an angled BC sounded like a complete load of BS.
Stop a tree from going over backwards, stop the tree from sliding of the stump.....whatever, if you have those kinds of things happening, you have far bigger problems than a sloppy back cut, like perhaps finding a new line of work more suited to your haphazard ways.
Undercuts, and back cuts are very easy to do correctly and safely !
There is never any reason to do otherwise.

Like it or not, Arborist's around the world have to fight an image problem.
A LOT of people seem to think of tree trimmers/climber/loppers/etc.../etc... as a bunch of wild, uneducated, stinky and hairy bushmen, who couldnt cut it logging, and therefore have to make money cutting trees in the city.
A bit dramatic maybe but you get the idea right, so when an Arborist is making excuses for his sloppy, unacceptable(to me) work they are just re enforcing this stereo type and making us all look bad.
The sooner we ALL realize this and start working to change it, by NOT using unacceptable, unsafe, lazy work techniques and practices, the sooner it changes.
Don't misread the above bit, Im not trying to single anyone out, we can all improve, even if just a bit, I know theres lots of areas I can improve upon, and I work at it all the time !
Maybe some of use have more work in this regard than others, but we are all in the industry together, and it would behoove us all to remember and regard this.
Stay safe gang,

-Grais.

Therrin · 19th April 2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Its just what i've always done,no real reason behind it.

How can you claim to be soooo Great, and be doing things with no real reason behind them, even after they've been proven to be inadequate as far as technique and procedure goes?

I think you need to take a SERIOUS look at who you are, what you're doing, where you plan on going with it, and pull your head out of your ass somewhere along the way Bill. I'm tired of reading half the shit you post.

Try having a GOOD REASON behind what you do, instead of "no real reason".

newguy18 · 20th April 2009, 12:17 AM

The humboldt notch is outdated Ken?

spartek · 20th April 2009, 12:42 AM

"IS GETTIN HOT IN HERE"

I agree, I'm tired of reading you'e stupid and unsafe remarks and comments as well , Newguy. Sooner than later you're luck is going to run out, AND IT WILL. And some poor bastard is gonna have to scrape up whats left of you, but hell ,who cares , cause its the tree thats at stake, right??? I think you're hopeless, you'll never change. You don't listen or learn and you think you know every frikkin little thing there is to know about evrything. IMO, your must be insecure as hell, thats why you keep tootin your own horn. Hell,,, you're a real ONE MAN BAND. Keep up the good work. If you're so great, and you gotta shitcan safety and common sense , so you can get more trees done in one day , then by no means should you be wrenchin on some old piece of crap truck. You should slow down and raise you're prices. But it sounds like you aren't worth the price you are charging NOW!!! Sorry for being SO harsh, but when it comes time to responding to bullsh*t, this is the way , "I've always done it"

HolmenTree · 20th April 2009, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pomie

hi guys on the subject of a humbolt if you use it to take a top out of a tree would,nt it make the top of the tree spring more as the fibres are holding on longerand further in the felling

As I said earlier I like the humbolt with a 45 degree opening because of the top being thrown out horizontially, but yes you get lots of bending in the stem. Now if I'm butt hitching the top down I put aleast a 70 degree opening in that humbolt or just a 90 V notch.
When a top goes over on a verticle standing tree the most backwards bending on the stem is when the top is at 45 degrees angle no matter what kind of notch you have. At this angle if you only have a 45 notch it will be closed which makes another force of energy transfer when the hinge breaks.When these two forces happen simultaneously [maximum bending movement and the top breaking free] you will have the greatest rocking movement of the stem. You will have alot LESS stem rocking if you went 70 but the top will land on it's tip if just free topping. So maybe I was a little premature on advising the 45 degree notch because of the structural dangers of certain trees.
Watch Heli-Loggers on tv and you will see they all free top with a humblolt, in 200 plus foot tall red cedar at 150 feet.

newguy18 · 20th April 2009, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spartek

"IS GETTIN HOT IN HERE"

I agree, I'm tired of reading you'e stupid and unsafe remarks and comments as well , Newguy. Sooner than later you're luck is going to run out, AND IT WILL. And some poor bastard is gonna have to scrape up whats left of you, but hell ,who cares , cause its the tree thats at stake, right??? I think you're hopeless, you'll never change. You don't listen or learn and you think you know every frikkin little thing there is to know about evrything. IMO, your must be insecure as hell, thats why you keep tootin your own horn. Hell,,, you're a real ONE MAN BAND. Keep up the good work. If you're so great, and you gotta shitcan safety and common sense , so you can get more trees done in one day , then by no means should you be wrenchin on some old piece of crap truck. You should slow down and raise you're prices. But it sounds like you aren't worth the price you are charging NOW!!! Sorry for being SO harsh, but when it comes time to responding to bullsh*t, this is the way , "I've always done it"

Wtf is wrong with useing a humboldt cut for topping?Its not considered unsafe dumbass.I'm all about how quick and efficient i can work,which means ansi gets pushed to oneside daily,its good for a beginer but for someone who is experianced beyond all reason its not practical or safe,if i died tommorow i would not care,dying doesn't even make me flinch,just never bothered me.

HolmenTree · 20th April 2009, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Wtf is wrong with useing a humboldt cut for topping?Its not considered unsafe dumbass.I'm all about how quick and efficient i can work,which means ansi gets pushed to oneside daily,its good for a beginer but for someone who is experianced beyond all reason its not practical or safe,if i died tommorow i would not care,dying doesn't even make me flinch,just never bothered me.

I think they are talking about the top removal comment with a angled back cut and humbolt.

newguy18 · 20th April 2009, 01:46 PM

Well hell,i just use a humboldt with a level back cut,i keep the back cut level with the under cut,cut the hinge up real thin and it reduces the movement do to less wood pull.

Therrin · 20th April 2009, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

i never had a problem lining up the cuts and when i use it aloft I make two opposing diagnols to the under cut to get a wide deep notch then I finish with an angled back cut at the same angle and cut it to about 3/8s of an inch for a hinge.if it would try and set back it"ll slide down into the rigging or ground however your doing it.in effect it works similar to a slice cut.

VS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Well hell,i just use a humboldt with a level back cut,i keep the back cut level with the under cut,cut the hinge up real thin and it reduces the movement do to less wood pull.

I think you also change up what you say your technique is as the climate of a discussion changes.

newguy18 · 20th April 2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Yep,exactly why i don't use it anymore,only time i use an angle cut is for the slice cut.

I see you missed this quote Ken,I quit using the angled cut except for slice and spear cuts,your taking my quotes out of context to make me look bad.

Therrin · 20th April 2009, 03:42 PM

Ahh, sorry. My bad. It really is difficult to keep up with how often you change when we bring these topics up. I must have just gotten confused in the whole mess of it all.

That came after the first part right? You should post up some pictures to get this thread really rolling NG.

newguy18 · 20th April 2009, 10:36 PM

My new boss is a fan of the angled back cut,he says its how he was taught when he did right of way for asplunduh.He does things his way,i do things mine.

Ekka · 21st April 2009, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

My new boss

Please expand on this part.

newguy18 · 21st April 2009, 10:20 PM

I started with another company about 2 weeks ago.

18th April 2009, 01:15 PM	#61
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts Just seems easier for me to place a humboldt cut when taking a top out. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

19th April 2009, 10:02 AM	#63
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts Its just what i've always done,no real reason behind it. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

19th April 2009, 02:16 PM	#64
Grais Sappling Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: B.C., Canada Posts: 46	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts Thanks Ekka. Why oh why do people try to explain away their outdated and dangerous techniques, thank you for putting so succinctly the reasons not too make such a sloppy and unprofessional cut. Every reason I have heard FOR using an angled BC sounded like a complete load of BS. Stop a tree from going over backwards, stop the tree from sliding of the stump.....whatever, if you have those kinds of things happening, you have far bigger problems than a sloppy back cut, like perhaps finding a new line of work more suited to your haphazard ways. Undercuts, and back cuts are very easy to do correctly and safely ! There is never any reason to do otherwise. Like it or not, Arborist's around the world have to fight an image problem. A LOT of people seem to think of tree trimmers/climber/loppers/etc.../etc... as a bunch of wild, uneducated, stinky and hairy bushmen, who couldnt cut it logging, and therefore have to make money cutting trees in the city. A bit dramatic maybe but you get the idea right, so when an Arborist is making excuses for his sloppy, unacceptable(to me) work they are just re enforcing this stereo type and making us all look bad. The sooner we ALL realize this and start working to change it, by NOT using unacceptable, unsafe, lazy work techniques and practices, the sooner it changes. Don't misread the above bit, Im not trying to single anyone out, we can all improve, even if just a bit, I know theres lots of areas I can improve upon, and I work at it all the time ! Maybe some of use have more work in this regard than others, but we are all in the industry together, and it would behoove us all to remember and regard this. Stay safe gang, -Grais.

20th April 2009, 12:17 AM	#66
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts The humboldt notch is outdated Ken? __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

20th April 2009, 12:42 AM	#67
spartek Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio, USA Posts: 156	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts "IS GETTIN HOT IN HERE"I agree, I'm tired of reading you'e stupid and unsafe remarks and comments as well , Newguy. Sooner than later you're luck is going to run out, AND IT WILL. And some poor bastard is gonna have to scrape up whats left of you, but hell ,who cares , cause its the tree thats at stake, right??? I think you're hopeless, you'll never change. You don't listen or learn and you think you know every frikkin little thing there is to know about evrything. IMO, your must be insecure as hell, thats why you keep tootin your own horn. Hell,,, you're a real ONE MAN BAND. Keep up the good work. If you're so great, and you gotta shitcan safety and common sense , so you can get more trees done in one day , then by no means should you be wrenchin on some old piece of crap truck. You should slow down and raise you're prices. But it sounds like you aren't worth the price you are charging NOW!!! Sorry for being SO harsh, but when it comes time to responding to bullsh*t, this is the way , "I've always done it"

20th April 2009, 01:46 PM	#71
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts Well hell,i just use a humboldt with a level back cut,i keep the back cut level with the under cut,cut the hinge up real thin and it reduces the movement do to less wood pull. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

20th April 2009, 03:42 PM	#74
Therrin Tree World Ninja Monkey Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Bakersfield, Ca Posts: 2,554	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts Ahh, sorry. My bad. It really is difficult to keep up with how often you change when we bring these topics up. I must have just gotten confused in the whole mess of it all. That came after the first part right? You should post up some pictures to get this thread really rolling NG.

20th April 2009, 10:36 PM	#75
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts My new boss is a fan of the angled back cut,he says its how he was taught when he did right of way for asplunduh.He does things his way,i do things mine. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

21st April 2009, 10:20 PM	#77
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,204	Re: Angled back cut\| backcut\| tree felling\| back cuts I started with another company about 2 weeks ago. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

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