Stihl MS361 upgrades and options

windthrown · 19th July 2010, 08:51 PM

Yah, hard to believe that Gary the Oil Man would post that much.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 20th July 2010, 06:39 PM

I stihl have my 361 and love it,but after muff mod and tabs cut off the restricter,i stihl cant make the sparkplug completly chokolade brown??!!does someone have any numbers for jets and which one??

rick · 20th July 2010, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

I stihl have my 361 and love it,but after muff mod and tabs cut off the restricter,i stihl cant make the sparkplug completly chokolade brown??!!does someone have any numbers for jets and which one??

Err, does the saw four stroke out of the cut or even just as you release pressure in the cut ?

If so, it'll be fine, it's rich enough.

It can be deceptive to try and chase an insulator colour with unleaded fuel as it changes a bit around the world depending on additives used so it can be deceptive as an indicator, unless you are used to your local stuff and are referencing back to it.

windthrown · 21st July 2010, 06:28 AM

Not unlike my 044... the Euro 361 is different than the US one (muffler and cylinder). We discussed some of this on another thread on AS with some of the jet numbers. I do not have them for the 361 (or the 044 for that matter).

MS 390 (Denmark) · 21st July 2010, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick

Err, does the saw four stroke out of the cut or even just as you release pressure in the cut ?

If so, it'll be fine, it's rich enough.

It can be deceptive to try and chase an insulator colour with unleaded fuel as it changes a bit around the world depending on additives used so it can be deceptive as an indicator, unless you are used to your local stuff and are referencing back to it.

it 4 strokes and also when i release the pressure, it is aspen gas that I use

SawTroll · 21st July 2010, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick

Err, does the saw four stroke out of the cut or even just as you release pressure in the cut ?

If so, it'll be fine, it's rich enough.

It can be deceptive to try and chase an insulator colour with unleaded fuel as it changes a bit around the world depending on additives used so it can be deceptive as an indicator, unless you are used to your local stuff and are referencing back to it.

There is no problem hearing when a 361 is "four stroking" or not, even with my really messed up hearing!

Mine does it well over 14K.

windthrown · 21st July 2010, 12:08 PM

What was that you said?

What?

SawTroll · 21st July 2010, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windthrown

What was that you said?

What?

What??????

windthrown · 21st July 2010, 12:18 PM

I can't hear you!

Who lives in a pinnapple under the sea?
Sponge Bob Square Pants!

Bill Becker · 24th July 2010, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

I stihl have my 361 and love it,but after muff mod and tabs cut off the restricter,i stihl cant make the sparkplug completly chokolade brown??!!does someone have any numbers for jets and which one??

0.46 - 1121 121 5601
0.52 - 1121 121 5602 (stock jet in my new MS361)
0.56 - 1120 121 5600
0.66 - 1128 121 5605
0.68 - 1128 121 5603
0.70 - 1128 121 5602 (installed in my 3 MS460s, were 0.62, 0.64, 0.68)
0.74 - 1122 121 5607 (installed in my 064, 066, MS650, were 0.64)
0.88 - 1124 121 5609 (084/088/MS880)
1.04 - 1124 121 5604 (084/088/MS880)

When changing jets increase 1 size and then test and adjust (use a tach). DP mufflers may need 2 or 3 sizes increase depending on original jet size, will increase fuel consumption and noise.

Dual port exhaust muffler covers:
044/046/MS460 - 1128 140 0801
064/066/MS/650/MS660 - 1122 140 0800

Carburetors with fully adjustable fuel mixture screws:
044/046/MS460 - 1128 120 0624 with 0.70 jet.
064/066/MS650/MS660 - 1122 120 0621 with 0.64 jet.

We've been running VP Racing Fuels SEF94 (no ethanol) with Stihl Ultra synthetic oil at 40/1 - saws start easier, rev quicker and no water or crud in the fuel tanks or carbs. Worth the cost when several employees are on the job, noticeable increase in productivity, less maintenance and repairs. We also use it without premix oil in the small 4 stroke equipment we have.

Many newer saws come with a jet that is not threaded into the carb body making it difficult or not possible to replace. I bought an MS361 instead of the MS362 for this reason.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 24th July 2010, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Becker

0.46 - 1121 121 5601
0.52 - 1121 121 5602 (stock jet in my new MS361)
0.56 - 1120 121 5600
0.66 - 1128 121 5605
0.68 - 1128 121 5603
0.70 - 1128 121 5602 (installed in my 3 MS460s, were 0.62, 0.64, 0.68)
0.74 - 1122 121 5607 (installed in my 064, 066, MS650, were 0.64)
0.88 - 1124 121 5609 (084/088/MS880)
1.04 - 1124 121 5604 (084/088/MS880)

When changing jets increase 1 size and then test and adjust (use a tach). DP mufflers may need 2 or 3 sizes increase depending on original jet size, will increase fuel consumption and noise.

Dual port exhaust muffler covers:
044/046/MS460 - 1128 140 0801
064/066/MS/650/MS660 - 1122 140 0800

Carburetors with fully adjustable fuel mixture screws:
044/046/MS460 - 1128 120 0624 with 0.70 jet.
064/066/MS650/MS660 - 1122 120 0621 with 0.64 jet.

We've been running VP Racing Fuels SEF94 (no ethanol) with Stihl Ultra synthetic oil at 40/1 - saws start easier, rev quicker and no water or crud in the fuel tanks or carbs. Worth the cost when several employees are on the job, noticeable increase in productivity, less maintenance and repairs. We also use it without premix oil in the small 4 stroke equipment we have.

Many newer saws come with a jet that is not threaded into the carb body making it difficult or not possible to replace. I bought an MS361 instead of the MS362 for this reason.

Your the man Bill...... thanks

do you know if there is a different jet in the euro version 361??,it has another cylinder/muffler

Bill Becker · 24th July 2010, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

Your the man Bill...... thanks

do you know if there is a different jet in the euro version 361??,it has another cylinder/muffler

No, I don't have access to the parts manuals for them. Your local dealer should be able to tell you the size and part number. You can also take the carb apart and see the jet size number stamped in the base of the jet.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 24th July 2010, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Becker

No, I don't have access to the parts manuals for them. Your local dealer should be able to tell you the size and part number. You can also take the carb apart and see the jet size number stamped in the base of the jet.

i´ll talk to my dealer...... thanks for the quick answer

windthrown · 25th July 2010, 05:13 AM

Thanks for the data Bill. You are the man! This data is hard to find.

I really need to re-jet my 044. Will probably re-jet all the 361s as well.

Bill Becker · 25th July 2010, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windthrown

Thanks for the data Bill. You are the man! This data is hard to find.

I really need to re-jet my 044. Will probably re-jet all the 361s as well.

I have a very old 044, the carb did not have a removable jet, could not tell what size was in it, had to put a new carb on it.

FlashD · 25th July 2010, 02:11 PM

Well, as perfect as the 361 is, my boss has one that has a scored p&s. I've thought about asking him if he'd sell me this saw and rebuilding it. My question is, has anyone every used a big bore kit for this saw, and is it worth it? Or, should I just got back to the stock p&s?

windthrown · 25th July 2010, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Becker

I have a very old 044, the carb did not have a removable jet, could not tell what size was in it, had to put a new carb on it.

I have a later model 044 with a removable jet. Should be no problem.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 26th July 2010, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

I stihl have my 361 and love it,but after muff mod and tabs cut off the restricter,i stihl cant make the sparkplug completly chokolade brown??!!does someone have any numbers for jets and which one??

not chokolade brown... coffee with milk........

MS 390 (Denmark) · 26th July 2010, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Becker

No, I don't have access to the parts manuals for them. Your local dealer should be able to tell you the size and part number. You can also take the carb apart and see the jet size number stamped in the base of the jet.

I talked to my dealer.... it´s a 0,52 jet in a euro 361

windthrown · 27th July 2010, 07:07 PM

My US 361 IPL says that the jet is fixed, and its an 0.52 size. I wonder if these can be sized up???

MS 390 (Denmark) · 27th July 2010, 07:25 PM

dang...... I really hope so...... I have just bourght a 044 puzzle(ebay),can´t wait she arrives,dont know if it´s a 10 mil/12 mil version........ do you have some ekstra parts,if I need some??

Bill Becker · 28th July 2010, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windthrown

My US 361 IPL says that the jet is fixed, and its an 0.52 size. I wonder if these can be sized up???

I believe "fixed" means that the orifice is not centered around a tapered needle like what would be on a motorcycle carb. The motorcycle carb will pass more or less fuel through the jet depending on the position of the needle which is dependent on the position of the slide. On a chain saw carb the metering diaphragm will usually allow more fuel than what the jet will allow through, thus the "fixed" jet is not variable. The high speed needle adjustment is what allows you to vary the amount of fuel at wide open throttle through the metering diaphragm and jet. On a motorcycle you need to have smooth performance of a carb throughout the entire range of the throttle opening. On a chainsaw you need to only have it idle and run wide open throttle, saws don't run well at mid throttle and they don't need to, cutting wood at mid throttle is not recommended.

Newer chainsaws have gotten leaner (smaller jet) and quieter (more restrictive exhaust). Looking at the parts manuals of older model saws and overseas models shows larger jets and less restrictive mufflers (my previous post in this thread lists the part numbers). With a larger jet you will pass more fuel and move the adjustment range of the high speed needle. Too much fuel (richer) will decrease performance and create soot and smoke. Too little (leaner) will cause excessive wear and possibly seize. Several local shops have told me they get a lot of newer equipment in for repair due to seizing. Some caused by the leaner carbs, some from the ethanol and some due to the operator.

I spent a lot of time this year rebuilding my saws, new and old. I use the carb rebuild kits from Zama and Walbro, the jets and exhaust covers from Stihl. The last 4 MS460s that I bought had progressively smaller jets. I'm using a 0.70 in all of them, dual port exhaust muffler covers in all but one. They are stock otherwise.

I have not done anything to the MS361, my climber uses that up in the tree, we don't use it on the ground. So far I'm pleased with it's performance however later this year I plan to try a 0.56 jet (1120 121 5600).

That was the short reply, I welcome any further input/correction/information.

Cut4fun · 28th July 2010, 11:38 AM

In my area of the mid-west I have never seen a reason for a jet change in a Gooood

woods ported work saw.
Maybe something to do with the air in the PNW. I know the air messed with my dirt bikes when I lived in MT.

Stock muffler modded MS361 in 16" yellow poplar, not ash as video states

You Tube

woods ported MS361 with STOCK carb and jetting. First woods ported 361 to ever out cut my woods ported 357xp. I tested them back to back same chain same wood. Says something about the modders work IMHO, trust me not all woods porting is goood

. Same 16" yellow poplar, not ash as stated again. Same chain.

You Tube

windthrown · 28th July 2010, 07:58 PM

Sounds reasonable to me. Excellent post, actually.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Becker

I believe "fixed" means that the orifice is not centered around a tapered needle like what would be on a motorcycle carb. The motorcycle carb will pass more or less fuel through the jet depending on the position of the needle which is dependent on the position of the slide. On a chain saw carb the metering diaphragm will usually allow more fuel than what the jet will allow through, thus the "fixed" jet is not variable. The high speed needle adjustment is what allows you to vary the amount of fuel at wide open throttle through the metering diaphragm and jet. On a motorcycle you need to have smooth performance of a carb throughout the entire range of the throttle opening. On a chainsaw you need to only have it idle and run wide open throttle, saws don't run well at mid throttle and they don't need to, cutting wood at mid throttle is not recommended.

Newer chainsaws have gotten leaner (smaller jet) and quieter (more restrictive exhaust). Looking at the parts manuals of older model saws and overseas models shows larger jets and less restrictive mufflers (my previous post in this thread lists the part numbers). With a larger jet you will pass more fuel and move the adjustment range of the high speed needle. Too much fuel (richer) will decrease performance and create soot and smoke. Too little (leaner) will cause excessive wear and possibly seize. Several local shops have told me they get a lot of newer equipment in for repair due to seizing. Some caused by the leaner carbs, some from the ethanol and some due to the operator.

I spent a lot of time this year rebuilding my saws, new and old. I use the carb rebuild kits from Zama and Walbro, the jets and exhaust covers from Stihl. The last 4 MS460s that I bought had progressively smaller jets. I'm using a 0.70 in all of them, dual port exhaust muffler covers in all but one. They are stock otherwise.

I have not done anything to the MS361, my climber uses that up in the tree, we don't use it on the ground. So far I'm pleased with it's performance however later this year I plan to try a 0.56 jet (1120 121 5600).

That was the short reply, I welcome any further input/correction/information.

windthrown · 28th July 2010, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

dang...... I really hope so...... I have just bourght a 044 puzzle(ebay),can´t wait she arrives,dont know if it´s a 10 mil/12 mil version........ do you have some ekstra parts,if I need some??

You can figure out the 10/12mm wrist pin difference on an 044 from the serial number. Older ones have the 10mm, up to serial number x29382283. Any 044 with a serial number higher than that and they have 12mm wrist pins.

I do not have any spare parts for the 044 except the original solid muffler cover. I have lots of extra 026 and 025 parts, and some 310 parts.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 28th July 2010, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windthrown

You can figure out the 10/12mm wrist pin difference on an 044 from the serial number. Older ones have the 10mm, up to serial number x29382283. Any 044 with a serial number higher than that and they have 12mm wrist pins.

I do not have any spare parts for the 044 except the original solid muffler cover. I have lots of extra 026 and 025 parts, and some 310 parts.

ok,it was worth a try..... I couldent se it on the pictures but it´s torn apart,so no problem when she arrives

by the way..... just bourght a 084av running saw,she will be delivered on monday....... what´s a good price??

Therrin · 28th July 2010, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlashD

Well, as perfect as the 361 is, my boss has one that has a scored p&s. I've thought about asking him if he'd sell me this saw and rebuilding it. My question is, has anyone every used a big bore kit for this saw, and is it worth it? Or, should I just got back to the stock p&s?

I have a 361 powerhead with a scored P&S that I'm looking to sell, if you're interested.

I had it for about 3 years and the P&S lean seized on me, so I got the Bailey's big bore kit for it. It worked very well untill about 8 months later or so it scored the P&S again. Same exact mix I was running in all my other saws on the same day and didn't have any trouble with them. Just the 361. I'd been very carefull since the first time to check its tuning when changing elevation, and to let it warm up, and sit at idle and cool down a little after using and while in the middle of regular use. For some reason I can't seem to keep it from scoring the P&S.

I had even just recently replaced the plastic covers and chainbrake handle with new parts. They had been a little scratched and a tad banged up, but they're all nice and purdy at the moment. I had even gone through the whole saw, disassembled and cleaned the whole thing.
If you're interested in working on one and rebuilding the P&S go ahead and PM me about it.

windthrown · 29th July 2010, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

ok,it was worth a try..... I couldent se it on the pictures but it´s torn apart,so no problem when she arrives

by the way..... just bourght a 084av running saw,she will be delivered on monday....... what´s a good price??

I do not know what any of the 800 series bad boy saws sell for. They are too spendy (and too large) for me.

I got news from the bank today that my rock bottom dirt cheap offer was accepted on some acreage in the West Cascade slopes. So I will be moving out there and making a lot of sawdust in the next year or two. There is a lot of pine out there, and a nice mix of birch, maple and some Japanese black pines that someone planted there about 40 years ago. There is more than enough room for Sueann's horses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

I have a 361 powerhead with a scored P&S that I'm looking to sell, if you're interested.

Geez, I cannot understand why you have blown up that poor 361 of yours. Is your 361 named Kenny? None of my 361s has a hint of scoring, and I have had the one now for over 4 years with maximum use and abuse. Seems odd.

MS 390 (Denmark) · 29th July 2010, 07:27 AM

congrats on the house and offcause the trees

Cut4fun · 29th July 2010, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS 390 (Denmark)

by the way..... just bourght a 084av running saw,she will be delivered on monday....... what´s a good price??

That really depend on a lot of factors. I have had 4 084's, 2 166, 2 3120's.

The prices range from FREE runner with issues to racesaws $3000.

Tell me more in a PM on your 084 with pics if you like and I can pretty much give you the PHO price if you like.

I have sold 2 084 and 2 166 already this year.

19th July 2010, 08:51 PM	#151
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options Yah, hard to believe that Gary the Oil Man would post that much.

20th July 2010, 06:39 PM	#152
MS 390 (Denmark) Sappling Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Denmark Posts: 47	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options I stihl have my 361 and love it,but after muff mod and tabs cut off the restricter,i stihl cant make the sparkplug completly chokolade brown??!!does someone have any numbers for jets and which one?? __________________ Best regards Jan Stay Sharp.... My Saws: STIHL 046,MS361,MS200,MS192T

21st July 2010, 06:28 AM	#154
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options Not unlike my 044... the Euro 361 is different than the US one (muffler and cylinder). We discussed some of this on another thread on AS with some of the jet numbers. I do not have them for the 361 (or the 044 for that matter).

21st July 2010, 12:08 PM	#157
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options What was that you said? What?

21st July 2010, 12:18 PM	#159
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options I can't hear you! Who lives in a pinnapple under the sea? Sponge Bob Square Pants!

25th July 2010, 05:13 AM	#164
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options Thanks for the data Bill. You are the man! This data is hard to find. I really need to re-jet my 044. Will probably re-jet all the 361s as well.

25th July 2010, 02:11 PM	#166
FlashD Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 213	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options Well, as perfect as the 361 is, my boss has one that has a scored p&s. I've thought about asking him if he'd sell me this saw and rebuilding it. My question is, has anyone every used a big bore kit for this saw, and is it worth it? Or, should I just got back to the stock p&s?

27th July 2010, 07:07 PM	#170
windthrown Former Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Great Pacific Northwest Posts: 1,211	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options My US 361 IPL says that the jet is fixed, and its an 0.52 size. I wonder if these can be sized up???

27th July 2010, 07:25 PM	#171
MS 390 (Denmark) Sappling Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Denmark Posts: 47	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options dang...... I really hope so...... I have just bourght a 044 puzzle(ebay),can´t wait she arrives,dont know if it´s a 10 mil/12 mil version........ do you have some ekstra parts,if I need some?? __________________ Best regards Jan Stay Sharp.... My Saws: STIHL 046,MS361,MS200,MS192T

29th July 2010, 07:27 AM	#179
MS 390 (Denmark) Sappling Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Denmark Posts: 47	Re: Stihl MS361 upgrades and options congrats on the house and offcause the trees __________________ Best regards Jan Stay Sharp.... My Saws: STIHL 046,MS361,MS200,MS192T

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