Longer bar for a 361?

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 06:56 AM

Hey guys, need some advice here.

Just got the contract for a job up in the mountains. 44" dbh pine fell over in recent windstorms, gonna take most of the wood and chip whats left, it's lying across a backyard.

I'm gonna do the job on monday. but was considering getting a longer and shorter bar for my 361.

Currently have a 24", was gonna pick up a 18" or 20" for the smaller side, and thinking about a 28-32" for the larger.

What's the biggest bar that you'd use with a 361?
What would you suggest for a smaller bar size?

newguy18 · 19th April 2008, 07:01 AM

According to stihl's website,it shouldn't pull bigger than a 25" bar.16" at the smallest.
MS 361 Chain Saw - Stihl Incorporated United States - Products - Manufacturing and Selling The World's Number One Chain Saw

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 07:39 AM

Yeah I read that already, thanks though Bill.

More to the point I was wondering if anyone's gone bigger than 24" on the 361, and if it works.

16" is a bit small, I'd shoot for either 18" or 20" on the small side.

stihlin huskys · 19th April 2008, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Yeah I read that already, thanks though Bill.

More to the point I was wondering if anyone's gone bigger than 24" on the 361, and if it works.

16" is a bit small, I'd shoot for either 18" or 20" on the small side.

I have the 361 and run a 20" and think that it feels about right. Guess this gives you a reason to buy a new saw. But since it is pine I would think you could pull a 28"

southsoundtree · 19th April 2008, 08:23 AM

I've used a 28" on my 361 with full skip/ sharp chain.

The Stihl Saw shop guy told me that it would be alright. Didn't know that Stihl didn't advise it.

I think that if you go for a 28", using sharp, full-skip chain would be easier on the saw, along with not trying to max cutting speed. Mostly I use a 20", but had to cut some 40" rounds, so upsized without any noticeable harm.

On the big wood, I suggest moving the bar in and out of the kerf occasionally to help clear the chips so they don't bind up between the chain and bar.

Stihl would know best though.

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 09:29 AM

Thanks so far guys,

Just got back from my Stihl dealer. Ended up picking up a 20" bar with RS chain.
Also picked up some RM full skip chain for my 24" bar.

He also advised that I could put a 28" on it if I wanted, and said the same thing, to run full skip with it. And he mentioned that the RS isn't as good for dirty wood as the RM is because it will dull out quicker.

Most of the spar is lyin on the ground, on a mountain side. I figure whether I stick with the 24" or move up to the 28", I'm still gonna have to hit it from both sides.

Any reason why the 28" would make the process better/easier?

stihlin huskys · 19th April 2008, 10:00 AM

I honestly wouldn't worry about full skip on the 24 unless your crosscutting, you put the rsc on there and it will run like a striped ape. I just got back from the stihl dealer from picking up a new log roller, new guy lost one, He said you could easily run a 28" if your not leanin on it and that stihl is pretty conservative on the bar recomendations. Especially if your cutting soft wood.

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 10:11 AM

Isn't RSC the Rapid Super Comfort? My guy doesn't have that anyhow, but I'll remember that for later. I read on Stihl's website that it's supposed to retain most of the aggressiveness of the RS but at lower vibration levels. I'll have to get a feel for it and see how I think the RS compares to the RM, and then see if I can pick up some RSC.

Thx for the advice on the bar size. I might just jump up to the 28, but still trying to figure the benefit over the 24" since I'll still have to attack each side.

And yeah the stuff's pretty soft (I hope)... It didn't come down from being dead, just was leaning over too far and had too much sail weight. Should still be full of water.
He had talked to me about maybe taking it down before but then couldn't make up his mind. Then... the tree made up his mind for him =)

stihlin huskys · 19th April 2008, 10:27 AM

Honestly the benefit is 8", not a lot. Outside of our top handles we have two dolmar 5100's 16" and 20", stihl 361 with a 20" and A 575 with a 32" and pretty much have the 20's in our hands about 80% of the time. We run the rsc on all of our saws and full skip on the 575 for the simple reason most of the time we crosscut for the purpose of loading and it is a fastcutting chain that works real good with the new av systems, especially on husky and stihl.

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 10:35 AM

Yeah after having had the 24" since december, I've really been looking forward to the 20", so I think I'll get a ton of use out of it.

In lieu of crosscutting and loading, then bringing it out here just to split it, move it, and stack it....

I was thinking of just taking the splitter right out to the site, cut and split on site, stack it in the trailer, then just restack it when I get home.

I'm actually working on a welded steel cord rack which can be filled anywhere, and trailered to where the wood needs to go without having to transfer and re-stack. More on that later.

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 11:15 AM

Headed back to the shop...

Looks like at the very least I'll be converting my 028 over to 3/8" from .325. Give em some versatility that way since I don't have anything else in .325

stihlin huskys · 19th April 2008, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Headed back to the shop...

Looks like at the very least I'll be converting my 028 over to 3/8" from .325. Give em some versatility that way since I don't have anything else in .325

If you have the 361 with a 20" and 24 your 028 would be a real fast cutter with a 16" and gives you a pretty good combo. If you went to A 16 you wouldn't need to go to .325, the 3/8 would be a monster with that 50+ cc.

Therrin · 19th April 2008, 01:54 PM

Sound's like you've really got it figured out!!

That's pretty much the same conclusion I came to at the shop... Decided that I'd switch the 028 over to 3/8 from .325 and get a 16" bar for it, since I could ALSO use the 16" on the 361 if I wanted. And the 028 could use either the 16" or the 20" bar.

Problem is, I guess I need some change-out kit to swap the 028 over, before I can even put a 3/8" sprocket on it. The kit won't be in till sometime next week, so I just picked up a .325 RM chain to use in the meantime. After I swap it over I can still pop the .325 sprocket on it if I ever choose to, since I've got a brand new 18" bar and now a new chain for the .325.

Figured it'd be more convenient to swap it though.

That'll leave me with an 011 and a MS200T at 3/8" PM, with 12", 14" and 16" bars, and then the 028 and 361 running 3/8" full with 16", 20" and 24" bars.

Not a bad setup.

stihlin huskys · 19th April 2008, 02:14 PM

You sound like me. I spend saturday morning at the saw shop and the afternoon in the garage doing maintenance for next week. Sounds like you do a lot of cutting. You would be doing yourself a huge service by adding a saw in the 70+ cc, and being that you already have the 24" bar you would probably want to stay with stihl. Maybe a 441 or 460 or something in the used category, I had an 044 that I used for 8 years that was primarily a
24" But the big plus was that I pulled a 32" to buck up the big stuff. Sounds like you got a pretty good setup but believe me you get the big bar and you'll look for reasons to use it and glad you bought it when you find it, and wonder how you got along without it

JohN Dee · 20th April 2008, 04:40 AM

Hey Ken, are you running a spur sprocket or a rim n spline sprocket on your 361?

Therrin · 20th April 2008, 07:15 AM

um... on the 361 I've got the "easy" one

forgot which is which.

But my 028 has the "difficult" one, which is why I need the change out kit.

To clarify, I'm not chaning out the sprocket on the 361, I'm doing it to the much older 028 so that I can swap bars between the two and maintain using 3/8" all around.

For the changeover, parts was about $55US and labor was $15US. Total of $70US for the swap on the 028 from .325 to 3/8"

But like I mentioned, they didn't have the change-out kit in stock, so I just picked up a RM chain in .325 18" for the 028 to let one of my guys use for this job.

Btw, I was considering using that big Mac I was just given, but I noticed it's got a push-operated oiler on it. Wasn't sure if that's to provide *additional* lube, or if it was the only means of oiling the bar and chain. Decided not to find out on this job, which starts at 5am tomorow morning.

JohN Dee · 20th April 2008, 07:40 AM

Hmmm very hard to work out, I'll put up a pic. We run both and their both as easy as the other the pull out n change...

If your 361 has a rim n spline sprocket, then to run the 28 inch bar on it successfully, I think either you could change out the rim to a 7 tooth one and that will lower the speed at which the chain goes around and give you good power distribution for the longer bar OR you could swap it out for a 9 tooth rim and that would give you faster chain speed but with loss of power and I think excessive wear on your 361...

Alot of blokes round here change out the rim on their bigger saws here when cutting pine to a 9 tooth one for the faster speed - BUT only for pines and softwood. If they tried that on our Euc' hardwoods the saw would be toasted.

19th April 2008, 06:56 AM	#1 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Longer bar for a 361? Hey guys, need some advice here. Just got the contract for a job up in the mountains. 44" dbh pine fell over in recent windstorms, gonna take most of the wood and chip whats left, it's lying across a backyard. I'm gonna do the job on monday. but was considering getting a longer and shorter bar for my 361. Currently have a 24", was gonna pick up a 18" or 20" for the smaller side, and thinking about a 28-32" for the larger. What's the biggest bar that you'd use with a 361? What would you suggest for a smaller bar size? __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 07:01 AM	#2 (permalink)
newguy18 Tree World Icon Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,198	Re: Longer bar for a 361? According to stihl's website,it shouldn't pull bigger than a 25" bar.16" at the smallest. MS 361 Chain Saw - Stihl Incorporated United States - Products - Manufacturing and Selling The World's Number One Chain Saw __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

19th April 2008, 07:39 AM	#3 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Yeah I read that already, thanks though Bill. More to the point I was wondering if anyone's gone bigger than 24" on the 361, and if it works. 16" is a bit small, I'd shoot for either 18" or 20" on the small side. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 08:23 AM	#5 (permalink)
southsoundtree Gettin' motoring Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Olympia, WA, USA Posts: 16	Re: Longer bar for a 361? I've used a 28" on my 361 with full skip/ sharp chain. The Stihl Saw shop guy told me that it would be alright. Didn't know that Stihl didn't advise it. I think that if you go for a 28", using sharp, full-skip chain would be easier on the saw, along with not trying to max cutting speed. Mostly I use a 20", but had to cut some 40" rounds, so upsized without any noticeable harm. On the big wood, I suggest moving the bar in and out of the kerf occasionally to help clear the chips so they don't bind up between the chain and bar. Stihl would know best though.

19th April 2008, 09:29 AM	#6 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Thanks so far guys, Just got back from my Stihl dealer. Ended up picking up a 20" bar with RS chain. Also picked up some RM full skip chain for my 24" bar. He also advised that I could put a 28" on it if I wanted, and said the same thing, to run full skip with it. And he mentioned that the RS isn't as good for dirty wood as the RM is because it will dull out quicker. Most of the spar is lyin on the ground, on a mountain side. I figure whether I stick with the 24" or move up to the 28", I'm still gonna have to hit it from both sides. Any reason why the 28" would make the process better/easier? __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 10:00 AM	#7 (permalink)
stihlin huskys Break'n the ice Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: ohio Posts: 6	Re: Longer bar for a 361? I honestly wouldn't worry about full skip on the 24 unless your crosscutting, you put the rsc on there and it will run like a striped ape. I just got back from the stihl dealer from picking up a new log roller, new guy lost one, He said you could easily run a 28" if your not leanin on it and that stihl is pretty conservative on the bar recomendations. Especially if your cutting soft wood.

19th April 2008, 10:11 AM	#8 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Isn't RSC the Rapid Super Comfort? My guy doesn't have that anyhow, but I'll remember that for later. I read on Stihl's website that it's supposed to retain most of the aggressiveness of the RS but at lower vibration levels. I'll have to get a feel for it and see how I think the RS compares to the RM, and then see if I can pick up some RSC. Thx for the advice on the bar size. I might just jump up to the 28, but still trying to figure the benefit over the 24" since I'll still have to attack each side. And yeah the stuff's pretty soft (I hope)... It didn't come down from being dead, just was leaning over too far and had too much sail weight. Should still be full of water. He had talked to me about maybe taking it down before but then couldn't make up his mind. Then... the tree made up his mind for him =) __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 10:27 AM	#9 (permalink)
stihlin huskys Break'n the ice Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: ohio Posts: 6	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Honestly the benefit is 8", not a lot. Outside of our top handles we have two dolmar 5100's 16" and 20", stihl 361 with a 20" and A 575 with a 32" and pretty much have the 20's in our hands about 80% of the time. We run the rsc on all of our saws and full skip on the 575 for the simple reason most of the time we crosscut for the purpose of loading and it is a fastcutting chain that works real good with the new av systems, especially on husky and stihl.

19th April 2008, 10:35 AM	#10 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Yeah after having had the 24" since december, I've really been looking forward to the 20", so I think I'll get a ton of use out of it. In lieu of crosscutting and loading, then bringing it out here just to split it, move it, and stack it.... I was thinking of just taking the splitter right out to the site, cut and split on site, stack it in the trailer, then just restack it when I get home. I'm actually working on a welded steel cord rack which can be filled anywhere, and trailered to where the wood needs to go without having to transfer and re-stack. More on that later. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 11:15 AM	#11 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Headed back to the shop... Looks like at the very least I'll be converting my 028 over to 3/8" from .325. Give em some versatility that way since I don't have anything else in .325 __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 01:54 PM	#13 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Sound's like you've really got it figured out!! That's pretty much the same conclusion I came to at the shop... Decided that I'd switch the 028 over to 3/8 from .325 and get a 16" bar for it, since I could ALSO use the 16" on the 361 if I wanted. And the 028 could use either the 16" or the 20" bar. Problem is, I guess I need some change-out kit to swap the 028 over, before I can even put a 3/8" sprocket on it. The kit won't be in till sometime next week, so I just picked up a .325 RM chain to use in the meantime. After I swap it over I can still pop the .325 sprocket on it if I ever choose to, since I've got a brand new 18" bar and now a new chain for the .325. Figured it'd be more convenient to swap it though. That'll leave me with an 011 and a MS200T at 3/8" PM, with 12", 14" and 16" bars, and then the 028 and 361 running 3/8" full with 16", 20" and 24" bars. Not a bad setup. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

19th April 2008, 02:14 PM	#14 (permalink)
stihlin huskys Break'n the ice Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: ohio Posts: 6	Re: Longer bar for a 361? You sound like me. I spend saturday morning at the saw shop and the afternoon in the garage doing maintenance for next week. Sounds like you do a lot of cutting. You would be doing yourself a huge service by adding a saw in the 70+ cc, and being that you already have the 24" bar you would probably want to stay with stihl. Maybe a 441 or 460 or something in the used category, I had an 044 that I used for 8 years that was primarily a 24" But the big plus was that I pulled a 32" to buck up the big stuff. Sounds like you got a pretty good setup but believe me you get the big bar and you'll look for reasons to use it and glad you bought it when you find it, and wonder how you got along without it

20th April 2008, 04:40 AM	#15 (permalink)
JohN Dee Astronaut Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 679	Re: Longer bar for a 361? Hey Ken, are you running a spur sprocket or a rim n spline sprocket on your 361? __________________ Climber with slow climbing speed, must make up with mighty chainsaw roar. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Red : Green : Blue

20th April 2008, 07:15 AM	#16 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,113	Re: Longer bar for a 361? um... on the 361 I've got the "easy" one forgot which is which. But my 028 has the "difficult" one, which is why I need the change out kit. To clarify, I'm not chaning out the sprocket on the 361, I'm doing it to the much older 028 so that I can swap bars between the two and maintain using 3/8" all around. For the changeover, parts was about $55US and labor was $15US. Total of $70US for the swap on the 028 from .325 to 3/8" But like I mentioned, they didn't have the change-out kit in stock, so I just picked up a RM chain in .325 18" for the 028 to let one of my guys use for this job. Btw, I was considering using that big Mac I was just given, but I noticed it's got a push-operated oiler on it. Wasn't sure if that's to provide additional lube, or if it was the only means of oiling the bar and chain. Decided not to find out on this job, which starts at 5am tomorow morning. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703