Ideal bar length for stihl 441

family man

My 441 came with a 28 inch bar but I see the oiler has a hard time keeping up, chain gets hot, smokes and stretches. I'm thinking about going with a 20 inch bar and chain, what do you think about this setup? Ballpark? Mostly for fir/tan oak/ some madrone.

Eric Frei

Well, I see you guys (PNW's) always putting a lot larger bars on your saws than I would here.

The chain type also matters, is it a full compliment chain or a skip chain?

On my ms440 I run only an 18" bar, but what you are cutting matters too. What is the average dia of the trees etc you are felling?

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SawTroll

As short as possible, without getting rear heavy, as with all saws!

It can vary with brand and model of the bar........

family man

Some around 2ft diameter. Most probley around a foot or less. I know I can cut from both sides too.

Cut4fun

I know the stihl oilers are stingy. But have you tried turning the oiler all the way up?

family man

Yes, I have the oiler turned out as far as it will go. Doesnt seem like it has enough oil output for 28 inch bar. I have read on here about putting a 460 oil piston and bolt for more oil, any input?

stihlman441

I use my 441 as a firewood saw and have found an 18'' with a 8 pin sprocket is ideal,balances well and still has the torque and power to use the entire length even in dry wood.

family man

I'll give the 18 inch bar and 8 pin sprocket a go. I bet the saw will rip with that setup.

windthrown

Oh man, do not fall for what these guys say with shrimpy bar disease in Europe and the midwest, east coast, and in Oz!

Run at *LEAST* a 20 inch bar on that 441. I run 25, 28 and a 32 inch bar on my modified 044 no problem. I don't even run an 18 inch bar on my 361s any more, even with an 8 pin rim. Turn your saw over and turn the oiler all the way up. There is a small hole there on the bottom that you can adjust with the tiny orange Stihl screwdriver. They typically come in the 'e' position, which means 'ematic' (translates here in the PNW to 'stingey on oil'). There is no way in Hell's half that that 441 saw stock cannot oil a 28 inch bar. I would get a 25, or a 20... minimum. I have all those bar sizes, and the 16 and 18 inch bars only get used on my 026s.

18 inch bar on a 441... get real... An 18 inch bar on a 441 is a complete waste of torque, even with an 8 pin rim on it in hardwood like Madrone.... man, they sell 361s here with 28 inch bars on them. Not that they can oil that size bar, but they run with them, and the 441 can run the snot out of them ~and~ oil them.... I tells yah, all this shrimpy bar disease... what has the world come to in the days of short bars and strato engine saws...

Eric Frei

Heck, I run a 25" bar on my MS660!

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family man

Does a 20 inch bar require an 8 pin sprocket?

Cut4fun

None require, it's your choice.

windthrown

On a 441 I would put the 8 pin sprocket on it with a 20, as you will have so much torque its silly. You may as well convert the torque to higher chain speed with the larger sprocket. Even in madrone and white oaks, unless they are seasoned rounds, then your cutting some tough stuff. If you bog down in knots just flip it back to the 7 pin stock rim. Most Stihl dealers have 8 pin rims here. Chains also make a difference. With a 20 inch bar full comp is fine though. No need for skip on shrimpy bars.

On my 660 I ran a 28 or 32 inch bar. Mostly the 32. It was an R model though (bigger oiler), as is my 044.

stihlman441

Me too .........the faster you cut this one the earlier you can get onto the next one.

Cut4fun

066 16" - 32" with 8T

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family man

I must add that I am really impressed with the 441. Don't want to give the wrong impression. When the chain is sharp it will through 1/4 inch wood chips with a fury, even with the 28 in bar. Minimum vibrations. Starts easy consistently, 1 or two 2 pulls, dependable. Going to change out the chain with a new one too, as its at the end of its life cycle, Probley most of my problem.
However the 28 inch seems like its better sooted to softer woods, redwood, or a larger saw. Most of you seem to think a 20 inch would equate to a near bog free powerhouse of a saw, with the 7 pin?

windthrown

If it bogs, gimme a holler and I can look at it. Not that you cannot get any saw to bog down by levering on the handle hard enough, as I could bog my 460 with a 20 inch bar on it, even in Doug fir. But it does not happen as often. Personally I do not believe that smaller bars and chains are that much faster. Idle chain travel does not take up that much energy or create that much drag. Its when you contact a larger length of wood that the longer bar drag comes into play. The way to deal with that in bigger wood is to use skip chain on longer bars here with the likes of Doug firs. That is the chain that most loggers use here... or rather the chains that they used to use. Logging is in the tank here, along with most saw mills.

Cut4fun

OK you got me 16" - infinity on the 3 work 084 saws 8T - 11T on the 2 woods ported ones and up to a 9T on the stock 084. Not the piped one .

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newguy18

the 441 sucks,the 460 is sooo much nicer.I wouldn't even consider buying a 441.

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old schooler

windthrown

Well, the guy already like, owns it.

family man

Well when I bought the 441 I asked the salesperson if this was the most powerfull saw in its weight class and he said "yes." I was planning on getting a 440. I didnt know the 441 weighed the same as the more powerfull 460 then. However, the saw does have some nice benifits to it, less smoke and excellent anti vibe come to mind.

Cut4fun

441 I ran as a brand new demo saw had great AV IMHO, like a coil spring husky has for years. The 441 just seemed really underpowered to me in the 70cc-81cc class range.
But I also think the stock 460 is a pig too. So you know where I stand on that class of saws.

I dont ever see smoke, maybe you changed oil types?

newguy18

460
pros
more power
same weight
screams with a 20" bar

cons

uses more gas
isn't a husky
more expensive

441,nothing but cons
same power as a 440 but 1.5 lbs heavier
less torque than 460

but if your stingy or on a tight budget then yeah settle for an inferior saw.

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old schooler

family man

441 is not cheap. I dont see any of the stihl pro model saws as cheap for that matter. Stihl sees value in the strato saws, or they wouldnt have them in the line.

kflood74

I run a 25 inch on a 390 with no issues.

windthrown

Not cheap, no. However, its not the value in the strato design saws that made them change over from earlier models. Its the 2010 EPA laws that is forcing them to change over. Long story short, John Deere had the rights to a cleaner burning 2-stroke engine design, and they lobbied the US congress to pass stronger EPA laws. So Stihl and Husky (and Dolmar and others) came up with their own cleaner engine designs, and JD realized that they would not have a monopoly in order to get better established in chainsaws. In an about face, JD decided to get out of all hand held tools and focus on large equipment. In a weirder twist, they cut a deal with Stihl and Honda to be the main hand held tools sold in JD stores nationwide (not all of them, it remains an option for JD dealers).

In a parallel to US law enforcement changes, Europe has passed stronger AV laws to reduce vibration exposure to sawyers. So new saws must have reduced vibration as well. So for those reasons the 440 was replaced with the 441. In the end we have a whole new line of saws coming out from Stihl and Husky with strato engines, and Dolmar and Husky have catalytic converters on several of their saws. They all have better AV, and in the case of Stihl, they have adopted centrifugal air cleaning with the flywheel fan drive, to counter the competative designs and advertizing of Husky.

family man

Allright, so most people who responded run 18 inch bars with 8 pin sprockets on their 441's. Windthrown, you recommend atleast a 20-25 inch bar. How noticable are the two inches between the 18 and 20 inch bars?

family man

Has anybody else noticed how screwed the bar recomendations are on the STIHL - Welcome to STIHL - Saw | Chainsaw | Trimmer | Brushcutter | Clearing saw | Cut-off saw | Pole pruner | High-pressure cleaner | Earth auger | Vacuum cleaner site

Bruce Hopf

If it was me, I'd go with a 20" bar and chain set up for your 441. I've cut a lot of fire wood, with a 20" bar, and the 7 pin rim sprocket, that has been over 24", in diameter.
I cut manly Ash, and both Hard, and Soft Maple. Yes, I've had to cut on both sides of the tree, may not be as efficient, but we still managed to get the job done.
I had to put a new bar and chain set up a few years ago, for my Pro Mac 700, so I went with a 24", from a 20" bar and chain set up for it.
With that extra 4", it sure made a difference in balance, with more weight towards the end of the bar.
For my 044's, I run 20" bars, chains, and 7 pin sprockets, on them, and I have no troubles felling, and cutting trees over 20" in diameter.
I'd get a new chain to fit your longer bar, if you need a chain, and if needed, you'll have the longer bar, and chain, if you feel the tree is too big, in diameter, to fell, with the 20" bar, and chain set up. Bruce.

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windthrown

Its a regional thing. Anyone in the PNW will recommend a longer bar. That's the way we are here. Back east and in Europe, they run short bars. They generally have smaller diameter trees. I was once duped into running shorter bars on my saws, and then I saw the light, bought longer bars, and I never looked back. If you wanna go with the higher global vote and run a shrimpy bar, go ahead. I usually run 16 or 18 inch bars on my 026s, a 20 or 25 on my 361s, and a 28 or 32 on my 044. Oh, and the 2 inches are noticable, yes.

Also I wanna be at the PNW saw shop when they ask you what saw the 18 inch bar is for.