Soil subsidence and trees

dguntertrees · 22nd July 2008, 08:49 PM

Thanx Eric

Galbee · 23rd July 2008, 05:29 AM

Hey they are actually doing something pro-active for trees at last, im surprised that the london boroughs are setting the standard on this, but there may be a chance that the rest of the country will follow suit and then you never know europe, the western world. fingers crossed.
as usual Eric thank you your a star.

Done it · 15th February 2009, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Done it

Yep, blame the trees. Our house is just an old 50's timber, surrounded by trees [I have posted some pics in that tree hugger thread] it creaks & groans, when it rains the back door jams, when it's dry the front door jams, it's clay/shale around here & brick houses crack, trees or no trees. Do you think people will listen, no way. I just get sick of trying to explain it.

Well, we've had some RAIN. All day & all night.

If I could get the back door open I'd ????

dirtguy · 12th March 2009, 02:33 PM

I'm coming late to this discussion, but can't resist dredging this thread back to the top because expansive soils have been a hot button for me for a long time. BTW, being a registered geotech I have license to pontificate...

At least here in the states, builders are so short sighted that it takes an act of congress to get them to spend a little more money on their foundations. My opinion is that, if you have soils that are so highly expansive that relatively minor changes in moisture content can cause settlement on the order of inches (cm for you brits and aussies), then you shouldn't be screwing around with trying to deal with it by maintaining constant moisture content!!! There are too many unpredictable things that can screw up the moisture content balance; a water pipe breaks, a tree dies, somebody upgradient causes a change in groundwater flows, somebody changes watering patterns for a period of time... Where any of these unpredictable events can cause structural damage running to the multiple tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars, why screw with it??? Bulk up the foundation, people. An ounce of prevention and all that...

In Denver, Colorado there are huge problems with expansive shales. It is common practice there to build structures (even single family homes) on drilled pier foundations. In southern Cali, where expansive soils occur, it is common to use post-tensioned slabs, drilled piers, or other special foundation systems. In these areas, people have learned by sad experience that it's not worth it to take the lowest first cost approach to construction. Other areas, still need to catch up to that way of thinking.

In the case at the top of this thread, I don't see how cutting the trees down is a long-term solution to the expansive soil problem. In fact, you're going to induce more differential ground movement by tree removal. Why not leave the trees alone and deal with the root (no pun intended) problem -- the poorly planned foundation system?

newguy18 · 12th March 2009, 03:57 PM

Around here its push evry tree over then devleop,or develop in the middle of the woods with trees right up against structures[sometimes growing onto strucures].Plus bull doxers aren't exactly friendly to the remaining tree's root systems and they usually die within 2 years.

Ekka · 25th June 2009, 08:23 AM

Some more from the UK.

FT.com / Personal Finance - Subsidence claims expected to rise

Quote:

Subsidence claims expected to rise

June 24 2009 15:52

After the two wettest summers since records began the UK is finally experiencing a heat wave. But while this is good news for sun-worshipers insurers are warning that the hot weather will bring with it the risk of subsidence.

Incidences of subsidence increase in dry, sunny weather, as vegetation in the garden grows more quickly and requires more moisture. The movement of the soil beneath the foundations of homes can create thousands of pounds worth of damage to the home.

Halifax Home insurance says homes in the south east are likely to be more at risk, because of the warmer temperatures but warns that warm conditions predicted throughout the UK could mean subsidence is more likely for everyone.

Figures from the Association of British Insurers show that the insurance industry has dealt with 144,000 subsidence claims over the last four years alone, costing over £800m.

“Signs that a property might be suffering from subsidence include cracks in walls, particularly if they start from the corners of windows or doors which themselves may become difficult to open or close,” says Neil Curling, Halifax Home Insurance senior structural claims manager. You may also begin to see cracks appearing in the soil.”

He urges homeowners to take steps to reduce the risks to their property such as when buying a house to check for historical activity such as mining as 15 per cent of subsidence claims are due to previous mining activity.

Curling also recommends homebuyers check the property drainage as subsidence can be caused by water leakage into the soil - 15 per cent of subsidence claims arise from water washing away finer soil in the ground.

Another way to protect your property is to ensure trees are not too close to the outside walls. Tall trees too close can be an issue, particularly for homes built on a clay subsoil

“Tall trees close to the house can be bad news, particularly for homes built on clay subsoil. They take water out from the ground and cause it to shrink and move. Tree removal solves 84 per cent of tree-related subsidence claims.”

If you are concerned about subsidence the sooner you contact you home insurance provider the better so that appropriate action can be taken.

Ekka · 13th December 2009, 07:45 AM

The terminolgy was gained from govt sources, perhaps you'd like to contact them.

Two are listed in this post.

Tree & Root Damage

22nd July 2008, 08:49 PM	#61
dguntertrees Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mudgeeraba, SE Queensland Posts: 82	Re: Soil subsidence and trees Thanx Eric

23rd July 2008, 05:29 AM	#62
Galbee Veteran Heritage Status Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Brisbane Aus Posts: 1,187	Re: Soil subsidence and trees Hey they are actually doing something pro-active for trees at last, im surprised that the london boroughs are setting the standard on this, but there may be a chance that the rest of the country will follow suit and then you never know europe, the western world. fingers crossed. as usual Eric thank you your a star.

12th March 2009, 02:33 PM	#64
dirtguy Sappling Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oregon USA Posts: 16	Re: Soil subsidence and trees I'm coming late to this discussion, but can't resist dredging this thread back to the top because expansive soils have been a hot button for me for a long time. BTW, being a registered geotech I have license to pontificate... At least here in the states, builders are so short sighted that it takes an act of congress to get them to spend a little more money on their foundations. My opinion is that, if you have soils that are so highly expansive that relatively minor changes in moisture content can cause settlement on the order of inches (cm for you brits and aussies), then you shouldn't be screwing around with trying to deal with it by maintaining constant moisture content!!! There are too many unpredictable things that can screw up the moisture content balance; a water pipe breaks, a tree dies, somebody upgradient causes a change in groundwater flows, somebody changes watering patterns for a period of time... Where any of these unpredictable events can cause structural damage running to the multiple tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars, why screw with it??? Bulk up the foundation, people. An ounce of prevention and all that... In Denver, Colorado there are huge problems with expansive shales. It is common practice there to build structures (even single family homes) on drilled pier foundations. In southern Cali, where expansive soils occur, it is common to use post-tensioned slabs, drilled piers, or other special foundation systems. In these areas, people have learned by sad experience that it's not worth it to take the lowest first cost approach to construction. Other areas, still need to catch up to that way of thinking. In the case at the top of this thread, I don't see how cutting the trees down is a long-term solution to the expansive soil problem. In fact, you're going to induce more differential ground movement by tree removal. Why not leave the trees alone and deal with the root (no pun intended) problem -- the poorly planned foundation system?

12th March 2009, 03:57 PM	#65
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 5,191	Re: Soil subsidence and trees Around here its push evry tree over then devleop,or develop in the middle of the woods with trees right up against structures[sometimes growing onto strucures].Plus bull doxers aren't exactly friendly to the remaining tree's root systems and they usually die within 2 years. __________________ Have your say join us today. I ship USA saws out of the USA old schooler

13th December 2009, 07:45 AM	#67
Ekka Admin - Dip Arb & Hort & Seldom Wrong Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 9,788	Re: Soil subsidence and trees The terminolgy was gained from govt sources, perhaps you'd like to contact them. Two are listed in this post. Tree & Root Damage __________________ TAS Training & Assessment Services\| Arb and Hort Training available here Free Online Tree Value Calculator by TreeWorld Free Online TPZ and SRZ AS4970-2009 Calculator by TreeWorld Free Online Tree Surface Area and Tree Volume Calculator by TreeWorld Free Tree and Green Industry Deep Link Directory ... Yes, I also SEO (Optimize) and build websites that fly high in Google Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist, Tree and Arborist Reports \| Project Arborist

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