Chunky mulch is best

Ekka · 24th February 2007, 01:43 AM

Test was done by Yates. Chunky mulch is that defined as no pieces being able to go through a screen with 5mm holes.

http://www.sgaonline.org.au/info_mul...y_or_fine.html

I also think this web page sums it up well.

http://www.drouintreeservices.com.au/mulching.html

Quote:

The reason is that a chunky wood mulch allows the soil to breathe, allows water to easily penetrate through to the soil and doesn't wick moisture from the soil. It's the mulches job to reduce evaporation, shade the soil, suppress weeds, allow air circulation (as roots and soil need it) and decompose to add organic matter to the soil.

TreeCo · 24th February 2007, 06:03 AM

The ISA Journal of Arboriculture published an article some years ago rating mulches by nutrient value. Chipped limbs, twigs and leaves came in at the top. Barks at the bottom. Pure live wood chipped was somewhere in the middle.

Nice info on mulch Jason.

Notahacker · 24th February 2007, 03:41 PM

That is great information! Think of it guys. This makes the mulch we generate from chipping more marketable if this information was known to the public.

Shoot! Lot's of us tree guys give this stuff away, but it sounds like we should be $elling more of it.

Sean Freeman · 24th February 2007, 04:17 PM

It gets even better, Shigo used to say that someone would get very rich one day by sepersting their mulch into piles by species of tree chipped, so you'd have a pin oak pile, a live oak pile, a beech pile etc... Making sure that your mulch was free from rubbish and fungal pathogens (ie any tree felled due to fungi wouldn't go into the pile)

This mulch is then what is spread, vertically mulched ets around trees of that species. The leaves bark and wood tissues are covered in the very spores and micro-organisms that form symbiotic relationships with that species of tree, it is how the soil food web continually re-inoculates itself in nature.

Its a recognised practice in the management of veteran trees to use mulch of the same species to maintain and improve the vitality of the soil/root environment the rhizosphere. If you have a tree that you're caring for, veteran or not and you want to give it a boost without all the negative impacts of modern Nitrogen Ferts, than this is the way to go. Combined with decompaction its brilliant for trees, and results are visible for the client.

SF

Notahacker · 24th February 2007, 04:35 PM

Great point

a_lopa · 24th February 2007, 04:48 PM

I keep all red gum and certain other types of gum for myself,heres a pile of "sugar gum"mulch.

Having mulch sales can be a p.i.t.a in organising and timeframes of delivery but adds some good $$$$ on big chipping jobs,better of getting a $$$ than dumping it.

Sean Freeman · 24th February 2007, 04:51 PM

Thats a great looking pile...best super fund around IMO

SF

Ekka · 24th February 2007, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notahacker

That is great information! Think of it guys. This makes the mulch we generate from chipping more marketable if this information was known to the public.

Shoot! Lot's of us tree guys give this stuff away, but it sounds like we should be $elling more of it.

Bingo, still best to let it age though to prevent nitrogen leeching, however nothing wrong with throwing some organic fert down prior to mulching if fresh. (blood/bone, dynamic lifter etc)

Notahacker · 24th February 2007, 09:41 PM

I have an 1.5 acres and I live on a county road. I have good visibility and planty of space to dump it. Currently I give away all of my firewood in exchange of referrals. I used to burn my brush, but now I chip it all. That is why I have been considering selling mulch. As for the firewood: I think I will start to only sell hard woods and give away crappy firewood. Or, should I say, less desirable firewood? Folks out here don't like Cottonwood. And unfortuanetly Cottowoods tree removals are about 7 out of 10 for my business.

Ekka · 25th February 2007, 01:34 AM

The price of most mulches here varies around $55m3 and most tree guys are selling there's for $10m3 ... darned joke really but it isn't aged.

The only thing you'll need to figure out is how you load your truck again once you have piles of it sitting around.

a_lopa · 25th February 2007, 02:15 AM

I think 10m3 isnt that bad as i does shrink down to about1/3 its the free delivery that can be the killer i add a little on if its going more than 10ks

polly · 2nd April 2007, 12:46 PM

Hi ,

it's a constant thing for us also getting rid of mulch, it is amazing how many people ring and want mulch deliveires but it is just not economically viable for us to do that, I was glad to hear what you said boa about mulch from the tree being pruned is best to go under that tree, I am often tryinng to talk our customers into keeping their mulch and explaining why it is so good for their trees, now I have a scientific explanation, so thanks. also it really gives your garden an instant face lift.
It's ironic that often the best thing for trees is the cheapest.That is mulch, water, space mulch and leave them alone.

polly · 2nd April 2007, 12:48 PM

My spelling is terrible early in the morning,
he, he, he

mdvaden · 2nd April 2007, 07:58 PM

We have Douglas fir bark mulch that's chunky with fines, and then there is the chunkies of various size nuggets.

The two don't look good blended at all.

The nuggets are a horror story for fall leaf cleanup.

So the finer multitexture usually wins.

So we need to switch between the choices depending on maintenance and customer preference.

Around here, either one performs very well for local needs, considering our weather.

That table on the page is a nice tool. A printout of it could be handy to carry along.

Drouin's page may be a bit innacurate. Its accurate from the angle at which its presented. Some of the mulch that it speaks "less" of, is actually better for certain purposes, and the wood mulch better and worse for other purposes.

I've used most mulches extensively, even personally, and found benefits to each of them.

It may boil down to why people are mulching. The nutrient part may not be relevent if nutrition is not needed. The Online Forums that offers articles for CEU credits, ran an article not long ago, indicating that mulches don't draw nutrients up from the soil. So it may depend on if the mulch is for topdressing, or incorporating.

For incorporation and mixing, I've found that the finest mulches of all (not bark) improve soil the fastes and the best.

Some country clubs have purposely used bark in golf greens mixtures, because the type they used decomposed more slowly. And that was what they were hoping for.

The main negative I've seen from a mulch, is when ultrafine bark mulch gets compacted and crusted on top. It can almost be knocked on. I'd imagine that it really repels water, and may slow down gas exchange significantly. Thats one thing that the chunks have going for them - breathing.

Ekka · 2nd April 2007, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdvaden

The Online Forums that offers articles for CEU credits, ran an article not long ago, indicating that mulches don't draw nutrients up from the soil.

Mario, can you get a link to this.

It's been long said that some mulches draw N out of the soil sending plants yellow, I'd say you've heard that too so it's a myth?!

Are you also saying that mulching isn't always done for plants to benefit but rather to just cover the ground for other reasons?

Also, would you like to re-write Drouin's mulch page, that's Jason's website.

I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

a_lopa · 3rd April 2007, 01:50 AM

If Mario wants to edit my sites mulching section thats fine by me as long as its still aimed at sales!sold a few loads of cypress pine today buyer was putting it around his fruit trees i told him it will really give them a good acid hit!!!!LMAO

Most of the chips IMO are good.I have palonia,hakia,melalueca popping up around my yard from the chips.I have dumped a load of blackwood on a customer and he was very happy that sapplings were springing up!im waiting for the day the boots on the other foot!

TrevMcRev · 3rd April 2007, 02:42 AM

[quote=Ekka;1756] most tree guys are selling there's for $10m3 ... darned joke really but it isn't aged.QUOTE]

Well i reckon i've given away FREE about $250,000 worth of mulch over the last 10 years then.

And if we could move it at the $55m3 the garden supplies want for it

I think i need to have a lie down...........
and rethink getting a bigger yard to stockpile and sell it from.

24th February 2007, 03:41 PM	#3 (permalink)
Notahacker Gettin' motoring Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 17	That is great information! Think of it guys. This makes the mulch we generate from chipping more marketable if this information was known to the public. Shoot! Lot's of us tree guys give this stuff away, but it sounds like we should be $elling more of it. __________________ "Quality costs as much as it saves." My great uncle Simon Murphy

24th February 2007, 04:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
Notahacker Gettin' motoring Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 17	Great point __________________ "Quality costs as much as it saves." My great uncle Simon Murphy

24th February 2007, 09:41 PM	#9 (permalink)
Notahacker Gettin' motoring Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 17	I have an 1.5 acres and I live on a county road. I have good visibility and planty of space to dump it. Currently I give away all of my firewood in exchange of referrals. I used to burn my brush, but now I chip it all. That is why I have been considering selling mulch. As for the firewood: I think I will start to only sell hard woods and give away crappy firewood. Or, should I say, less desirable firewood? Folks out here don't like Cottonwood. And unfortuanetly Cottowoods tree removals are about 7 out of 10 for my business. __________________ "Quality costs as much as it saves." My great uncle Simon Murphy

25th February 2007, 01:34 AM	#10 (permalink)
Ekka Eric Frei Administrator - Brisbane L5 (Dip) Hort Cert III Arb + some Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 5,673	The price of most mulches here varies around $55m3 and most tree guys are selling there's for $10m3 ... darned joke really but it isn't aged. The only thing you'll need to figure out is how you load your truck again once you have piles of it sitting around. __________________ Remember to use the "search" function, if you have answers/questions post them so everyone can benefit. Free Tree and Green Industry Link Directory Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping Brisbane Tree Care, Consultations and Arborist Reports Forum Sponsors

25th February 2007, 02:15 AM	#11 (permalink)
a_lopa Astronaut Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Drouin Posts: 837	I think 10m3 isnt that bad as i does shrink down to about1/3 its the free delivery that can be the killer i add a little on if its going more than 10ks __________________ Free Tree Industry Link Directory Drouin tree lopping, land clearing and stump removals

24th February 2007, 06:03 AM	#2 (permalink)
TreeCo Afterburner is shakin' Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 260	The ISA Journal of Arboriculture published an article some years ago rating mulches by nutrient value. Chipped limbs, twigs and leaves came in at the top. Barks at the bottom. Pure live wood chipped was somewhere in the middle. Nice info on mulch Jason.

24th February 2007, 04:17 PM	#4 (permalink)
Sean Freeman PDF King & Arborist Extrodinaire Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Townsville Nth Queensland & Gold Coast Sth Queensland Posts: 1,521	It gets even better, Shigo used to say that someone would get very rich one day by sepersting their mulch into piles by species of tree chipped, so you'd have a pin oak pile, a live oak pile, a beech pile etc... Making sure that your mulch was free from rubbish and fungal pathogens (ie any tree felled due to fungi wouldn't go into the pile) This mulch is then what is spread, vertically mulched ets around trees of that species. The leaves bark and wood tissues are covered in the very spores and micro-organisms that form symbiotic relationships with that species of tree, it is how the soil food web continually re-inoculates itself in nature. Its a recognised practice in the management of veteran trees to use mulch of the same species to maintain and improve the vitality of the soil/root environment the rhizosphere. If you have a tree that you're caring for, veteran or not and you want to give it a boost without all the negative impacts of modern Nitrogen Ferts, than this is the way to go. Combined with decompaction its brilliant for trees, and results are visible for the client. SF

24th February 2007, 04:51 PM	#7 (permalink)
Sean Freeman PDF King & Arborist Extrodinaire Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Townsville Nth Queensland & Gold Coast Sth Queensland Posts: 1,521	Thats a great looking pile...best super fund around IMO SF

2nd April 2007, 12:46 PM	#12 (permalink)
polly former member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Adelaide Hills Posts: 74	Hi , it's a constant thing for us also getting rid of mulch, it is amazing how many people ring and want mulch deliveires but it is just not economically viable for us to do that, I was glad to hear what you said boa about mulch from the tree being pruned is best to go under that tree, I am often tryinng to talk our customers into keeping their mulch and explaining why it is so good for their trees, now I have a scientific explanation, so thanks. also it really gives your garden an instant face lift. It's ironic that often the best thing for trees is the cheapest.That is mulch, water, space mulch and leave them alone.

2nd April 2007, 12:48 PM	#13 (permalink)
polly former member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Adelaide Hills Posts: 74	My spelling is terrible early in the morning, he, he, he

2nd April 2007, 07:58 PM	#14 (permalink)
mdvaden Astronaut Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 578	We have Douglas fir bark mulch that's chunky with fines, and then there is the chunkies of various size nuggets. The two don't look good blended at all. The nuggets are a horror story for fall leaf cleanup. So the finer multitexture usually wins. So we need to switch between the choices depending on maintenance and customer preference. Around here, either one performs very well for local needs, considering our weather. That table on the page is a nice tool. A printout of it could be handy to carry along. Drouin's page may be a bit innacurate. Its accurate from the angle at which its presented. Some of the mulch that it speaks "less" of, is actually better for certain purposes, and the wood mulch better and worse for other purposes. I've used most mulches extensively, even personally, and found benefits to each of them. It may boil down to why people are mulching. The nutrient part may not be relevent if nutrition is not needed. The Online Forums that offers articles for CEU credits, ran an article not long ago, indicating that mulches don't draw nutrients up from the soil. So it may depend on if the mulch is for topdressing, or incorporating. For incorporation and mixing, I've found that the finest mulches of all (not bark) improve soil the fastes and the best. Some country clubs have purposely used bark in golf greens mixtures, because the type they used decomposed more slowly. And that was what they were hoping for. The main negative I've seen from a mulch, is when ultrafine bark mulch gets compacted and crusted on top. It can almost be knocked on. I'd imagine that it really repels water, and may slow down gas exchange significantly. Thats one thing that the chunks have going for them - breathing. __________________ ____________________________________ Grove of Redwood TITANS Oregon BIGOOT trap

3rd April 2007, 01:50 AM	#16 (permalink)
a_lopa Astronaut Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Drouin Posts: 837	If Mario wants to edit my sites mulching section thats fine by me as long as its still aimed at sales!sold a few loads of cypress pine today buyer was putting it around his fruit trees i told him it will really give them a good acid hit!!!!LMAO Most of the chips IMO are good.I have palonia,hakia,melalueca popping up around my yard from the chips.I have dumped a load of blackwood on a customer and he was very happy that sapplings were springing up!im waiting for the day the boots on the other foot! __________________ Free Tree Industry Link Directory Drouin tree lopping, land clearing and stump removals

3rd April 2007, 02:42 AM	#17 (permalink)
TrevMcRev Astronaut Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 672	[quote=Ekka;1756] most tree guys are selling there's for $10m3 ... darned joke really but it isn't aged.QUOTE] Well i reckon i've given away FREE about $250,000 worth of mulch over the last 10 years then. And if we could move it at the $55m3 the garden supplies want for it I think i need to have a lie down........... and rethink getting a bigger yard to stockpile and sell it from. __________________ Melbourne Arborist, Total Tree Care, Pruning, Tree and Stump Removal