Roots rising to attention

sandybottom

Help...I live in Montana. Our lawn is beautiful and green. Our dirt is almost all sand. We have five poplar type trees...all about twenty years old...more than thirty feet high. Problem??? The saplings that pop up all over our yard are easy to rid..we simply mow over them while they're fresh and young. It's the big boy roots that are starting to appear throughout our yard that are worrying me. Dinner plate size root wads are everywhere. Are our trees surfacing through the light sandy soil because of too much watering? We only water our lawns once a week and when we do it quickly sinks through the sand to the clay six feet below turf.
Any help would be nice..Thank you
Sandybottom

mdvaden

No, that's just what they can do in a lot of soil types.

Probably one of the situations where I'd add a little soil to smooth the grade and overseed.

Not "level" the grade - but smooth the grade. Enough to avoid mower damage.

Not inches of soil either. Inch and less.

Eric Frei

Sounds similar to our ficus (fig) species over here, surface roots are just what they do.

Have you considered swapping the lawn out for garden/mulched areas where it's bad? Just trying to expand your options.

Increasing soil ht like suggested may have to be done frequently.

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sandybottom

Thanks. I've been wanting to build little garden oasis's. Now it sounds like I have a ligit excuse.

Sean Freeman

I agree with the advice you've been given, especially the mulching option... it can be really surprising how two trees of the same species planted in close proximity to each other can have very different root growth characteristics. These are two Khaya senegalensis planted in a school here in Townsville, one has dramatic surface roots as you can see!! The other has not produced any surface roots to speak of at all.

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sandybottom

wow, my trees are not even close to that exposed. I guess my biggest worry is not the yard but are my trees still firm to the ground even they are starting to show through?

Eric Frei

Firmer than if you didn't see them, trust me on that.

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treeseer

Mario, if the added soil is loose, is there really a great fear of smothering? I think not. Most urban trees are eroded due to the removal of their leaves, wind, water, and other factors, so it makes sense to replace soil to make up for what has been taken away.

Eric Frei

Sean

Two things if I may.

#1 Those roots are a trip hazard.

#2 There's grass so mower and whipper snipper damage likely.

Does it matter or anyone care/complain?

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Sean Freeman

Yep, right on both counts, my experience is also that the contact damage surface roots experience from mowers etc create cylces of wounding that with the callous and woundwood production actually increases the size of the tripping hazard...Its worse too, just out of sight in the photo is a fire hydrant that the roots are rapidly enveloping along with the fire main! Yes they know all about it and have been given numerous options to remove or manage the problem as is often the case with institutions staff changes and different priorities result in inaction being the non-decision being made.

A most unsuitable species choice for the small space available....long term removal and replacement is the best option.

Eric Frei

Be a heck of a stump grind.

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mdvaden

In lawn areas, not usual, but it still happens sometimes. No accident that the lawn starts at sidewalk height on the the downslope, and in 10 years is 2" above the sidewalk concrete Good point.

But the erosion you mention if prevalent in a lot of areas of Portland.

Sure, replacement makes a lot of sense.

Drouin Tree Service

Mulching them would send out the smaller hair like roots from the exposed roots?

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Drouin Tree Services | Excavator Hire - Drouin and SE Gippsland | Landclearing Melbourne

Eric Frei

Not directly off those big roots but certainly of any strikers and laterals below them.

Often when I'm grinding ficus roots I'll plunge the cutter wheel down in the soil and reverse along cutting roots. Then I move over say 2m and do the same, with a mattock lift out the root. They always have lots of roots coming off below them, it's not like lifting up a piece of tube or pipe but more like peeling it off a velcro surface.

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treeseer

Gosh i wish i could reply to your post but since it is anecdotal i cannot stoop that low.



Seriously, good info; i was about to reply that branching from the underside could be more likely. Re tree and space, i can visualize a nice garden in there after soil and groundcover are installed.

remove and replace, and then wait 20 years? Not a plan this old man wants to hear.

Eric Frei

Great point, which should commence a new thread titled:-

Plants suitable for planting under trees - under planting trees

I have a few suggestions.

Bromeliads, their root system is predominantly to hang on not to draw from the soil, they rely on shade and hold water in their cup/throats.

Orchids would also be good as would many other epiphytes.

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treeseer

yeah but none of those are very foot friendly. we have shallowrooted vines like vinca, euonymus, helix, any of that familiar?

Eric Frei

Vines? You suggest planting vines near trees?

Ummm ahhh.

We want a garden that is foot unfriendly, hardly want compaction issues and the less people under the drip line the better. Oh, might have a chair there with a small path but that's it OK!

Anyway, back on topic.

Sandybottom

Check out the roots on these ficus trees. Note also that the roots aren't favouring the drain. Also note, rare sight, water in drain!

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Sean Freeman

Great pics love fig roots and that wet stuff all around on the ground that would be..........................RAIN!!!!

Drouin Tree Service

Great pics Ekka! Treeseer i agree 20 yrs is just too long in most cases.

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Drouin Tree Services | Excavator Hire - Drouin and SE Gippsland | Landclearing Melbourne

treeseer

{I looked to see whether Codit was paying attention. He was back in the Dubois yard, pruners in hand, looking a vine growing on a pine tree. ?Codit, what are you doing??

Codit dropped the hand pruners. ?Just looking, Dendro.? He protested, his cheeks as red as the holly berries on the lapel of Ms. Dubois? coat as she and Electra approached. ?I know some vines strangle trees, but since my new book says that arboriculture is the integrated management of landscape trees, shrubs-- like those waxmyrtles we worked on--, and vines, I was checking to see if it was a weed?.

?No cut without a reason, you got it? Electra smiled. ?Vines can be vile or valuable, according to the observer?s view. That is Campsis radicans, trumpetcreeper, and the next tree has Parthenocissus quinquefolia, Virginia creeper. They are clinging vines, not twiners like Wisteria floribunda and Lonicera japonica, which strangle the trees that support them.?

Ms. DuBois glowed. ?I?m so glad you know that, young lady. Mr. Dendro included the vines in his original landscape inventory. He knows that my favorite color is red. The first vine has red flowers and the second has red leaves. I also love the way they form a natural area as they creep along the ground.? Codit stashed the hand pruners back in his holster as he went back to the front yard.}

hey that was printed in arborist News so it must be fact eh?

eric you must have a lot of space in australia if you don't want people walking under trees. compaction from feet is moot if mulched.

hey i cannot make an attachment; what is up with that?

Eric Frei

Oh dont you start with that!

Try this, log out, clear cache and cookies of browser and log back in. If that doesn't work call some-one else.

I did a few minor changes, maybe you need to reset cookies.

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treeseer

i did not do anything; i just tried again, thanks. attached is where the quote came from, for those too stingy or ornery to join isa.

Attached Files

Dendro Lianas1.pdf (138.4 KB, 49 views)

Eric Frei

People that stingy they wont join ISA, fancy that, need a swift kick in the ..........

They may be in another one, lets see, NAA, QAA, TCIA, SAAA or NFL, ARL (they're footy ones) LOL

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treeseer

that's a big bowl of alphabet soup. i think you made half of those up--does NAA exist anymore? Isn't NFL about sports?. ISA is THE org that is dedicated to education about tree care.

sandybottom

You people are way too funny...but very helpful. I have decided that...my trees are not coming down...20 years is way too long for me also, The small glimpses of root popping up throughout the yard and beyond the drip lines I will gradually mulch and take care to decrease mower damage. Under drip line I will let the roots be what they will be. I will have five beautiful vine free shade loving flower gardens, drip line wide by this time next year. Will add a cobblestone path in some and occasional stepping stones in others. I have hired someone to come fertilize and take care of my ant problem. My trees, garden and yard will be beautiful, healthy and a joy for the rest of my life.
Thank you all...
Sandybottom.

Eric Frei

Why thanks and it sure sounds great, remember us here and perhaps put up some pics of progress.

Treeseer, you lost out on the vines with this one, tallyhoe ole chap.

Oh, I highlighted the part I liked best.

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treeseer

Before you declare victory (as if there was a competition), keep in mind that many shade flowers are vines, like several on this list: Perennials for Shade

Many vines are tree-friendly; that was the point of the Lascivious Lianas piece, plus of course the moral of the story, that all dogma is useless--even when taught as 'SCIENCE" by approved authorities.

Garden happily under the big sky, sandybottom!

sandybottom

Here are some of my trees. I don't know if you can tell what they are from these. I suppose the people that come out to care for them will know. Anyway...these are my before beautification pics.
I will keep in contact. Absolutely love this tree world sight.
Again...thank you.
Sandybottom

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Eric Frei

Very nice, room to breathe.

I like the old tractor there, looks good. I like things like that around, big old hoe, wagon wheel etc ... the modern garden has become some cross between a hedge and a bonzai to fit it in.

Plenty of room for mulch and some colour underplanting, few "farm bit" features be great.

Nice shots, nice place.

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