lightning strike oak tree

Pthrcruiser

Hi Guys: I've got and old oak tree five foot in diameter, eighty feet tall,and eighty to one hundred feet wide. This tree was topped around 1927, tree has perfect round canopy. Lightning struck center of treeand damaged vertical branches. My question to the experts is? can i cut the top out of this tree and save the rest of tree and what do i use to treat the cut areas against diesease and rot.

Ekka

First of all, and thanks for choosing us to share and help.

What would be really good is if you could get some nice pictures for us to see.

Sounds like you really love this grand ole tree, so before you do anything let us pro's here go over the tree and see what damage was done.

As far as your concerns with wound treatments and the like ... we'll get to that soon, but lets see why and where we need to make those wounds first.

For information on how to load pics etc just have a read here.

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When you do supply pics please grab a few of the soil and trunk area as well as a distance shot.

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Pthrcruiser

i belive i have uploaded the pic s let me know if they have come through

Ekka

No mate, didn't happen. Just use the paper clip thingy and make sure the file sizes aren't too big.

And once you hit "browse" then dont forget to hit upload after you selected your pic.

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Pthrcruiser

idont know what paper clip thing you are talking about

Pthrcruiser

can i e-mail them to you and you post them?

Ekka

How to post| add a picture or file| embed picture

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Pthrcruiser

i really want to save this tree as my wife will chain her self to it with her 125 pound puppy . she see s the face of god and his great might in all trees ,grass,wees lol thanks again

Attached Thumbnails

         

Ekka

This is what it's going to look like with the top out.

I'll let others throw up ideas, but I can tell you that painting and putting stuff over large cuts wont stop decay. Back in 1924 when it was topped it likely was smaller and a lot more vigorous.

Attached Thumbnails

 

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newguy18

right now eric as much as i hate to say it topping or reducing seems like the best bet.if i were doing it i would also get some light sheet metal and small stainless steel nails and make a cover for the wound to help keep watr out of it and take the bottom of the piece i cut off to make the pattern so i didn't go over the cambium.The callus should seal it in 1-2 growing seasons.

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old schooler

treeseer

Bill what is this prediction based on?

That wound will most likely never close, ever. You could get some useful years out of the topless tree if you just get the dead parts cut out and wait on the rest. the wood rots slowly so short-term it should be ok to keep it, unless a big storm whips those sprawling branches around.

did you call the insurance company yet?

newguy18

If you take the piece you cut off,strip the bark and make the metal fit close but not over the cambium it should seal the edges of the metal and callus over.Maybe not in a topping cut but in a collar cut it should.

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TreeSpecialist

I would suggest a simpler approach.

Do nothing physical to the tree - at least right now.

Fertilize, mulch, water but leave the top of the tree alone and see what happens.

The tree will show you what has been killed and what is still alive if you let it.

What appears dead or dying may come back somewhat if left alone.

Installing lightning protection in the tree would be a good idea as well.

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Ekka

What's all that "fur" where the limbs join the trunk? Looks like seaweed!

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blair duncanson

Is that a newish building at the base of that cracking tree?

StrictlyPalms

on a side note....


Are you Santa?

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treeseer

I agree, except it's too late for a lightning system. No harm in waiting for the tree to talk to you next spring.

When did the lightning strike? Bark can be reattached if you get to it soon enough. here is a treatment protocol, attached.

Eric it looks like resurrection fern

Bill if that wound closes up I will eat your boots.

Attached Files

Lightning TCI.pdf (642.3 KB, 102 views)

wattie

I would also recommend that you consider removing the grass area under the canopy,terravent the area and inject bio-nutrients and mycorrhizal fungi which will increase root hair growth even on older trees lightly break up the top soil and cover with a good quality decomposted wood chip and moniter.

Only problem I can see that we would recomend that the composted area extends to the canopy drip line which would be hard to do on the property side of course, but some thing is better then noting at all.

Worth a look at; www.kewgardens.co.uk and look for the Terravent link.

Good Luck.

kiwi_tree_steve

Ok is this an old practice?, Maby im "new school" but this approach seems absurd to me, and it goes against the Arb books ive read and all ive been taught.

no offense meant newguy, im just trying to understand.

i agree,

i would look at a light prune all round and removal of any dead wood IN TIME.

The tree will let you know what it cannot support or what decay in cannot compartmentalize.

As there is a dwelling right close to the tree, i would also look into some sort of non invasive bracing system, in essence to "catch" any limbs that fail, personally i would use COBRA. because of its shock absorbing abilities,and allowing the canopy its natural movement.



yes, ive seen some study on this, it looks very interesting, and my uneducated opinion is that it wont harm the tree, and will help with root hair growth, increasing the ability of the tree, in Nutrient uptake.

It sounds you love the tree, (even if you hate it your Wife loves this tree with a passion, so you love it too. well thats how it works with my wife!!lol) i think its worth, investing in a professional Arborist to come out and give you an assessment of this trees health.


good luck with saving this beautiful tree.

steve

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treevet

IMO the tree has already told you what is going die by the brown leaves. It is early summer here and if that leader is totally brown (and it is) it ain't coming back. Health improvement techniques do not seemed warranted as the tree had no problems in that area whatsoever. Ekka's very telling illustration is what you need to show the wife and see if she wants to live with the hazard initiated by the loss of this huge section of the tree in regards to what the tree will look like when you remove this dead section. Large pruning cuts are the biggest vector of decay of all. Decay will likely enter the base of the attachments of the branches over your house, and I bet they are very large branches. Also now these branches will be hit by winds that aren't buffered anymore by the one that will HAVE to be removed. Where are your prevailing winds?

If you do choose to remove the lightning destroyed section instead of the whole tree, you need a high level arborist. He should pull the dead section out with a crane in pieces so as to not damage any other foliage or conductive tissue, including the transition btwn the stem and roots and exposed roots so further death and decay do not occur. Next I would lighten all the canopy that could fall on your house no more than one third and leave the other side alone and not park under it. A big old tree like this has much more trouble losing large percentage of canopy than a younger tree.

As recommended, I would be talking to insurance. Often trees are covered by lightning damage but sometimes, being as tricky as they are, they exclude it and only cover wind damage. Whatever coverage you had I would, for future coverage, make sure you are covered in any event if you decide to keep tree. It will cost a little more, but worth it. If current guy declines to do this, you should go to another company and no need to explain the current status of this great old tree.

treevet

Also in hindsight while suggesting current action, you did not show the entire stem. I think you would have if there was a lightning wound on it. Because of this the lightning had to go somewhere (from the base of the dead leader) and if the trunk is clean it likely jumped into your house or may have jumped into roots and you may have future canopy die back with root death. The best thing is if it went into house or poss a well (for the tree). This another wait and see aspect.
As asked, when did it happen?

kiwi_tree_steve

IMO, i really think that if you are considering toping this tree, you should look into removal, and replanting. topping a tree effectively starts the dieing process, a wound of that type is a massive vector for decay, parasites, and pathogens .

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treeseer

No one has suggested topping. treevet suggested cleaning out the deadwood and light reduction over the house.

gavin160

gavin160 new boy in england.
i think if removal is not a option i would remove dead wood in first year and pollard in second only problem being the maturity age of this big boy.....will it handle it????

gavin160

just had another look at pics
removal looks like best option

treevet

By definition pollarding is not a possibility. You have to consider how the client feels first and then make recommendation. If it was a young couple just buying this property it is a totally different perspective than an older couple that has emotional ties to this tree and a long family history with it for example.

I would give that tree every available chance with our bag of tools if they gave the go ahead.

gavin160

yeah would be a shock to the system for them but at the end of the day a 3rd of the crown is dead... chances are if this much of the crown was to be removed there would be failure to remaining limbs at some time

treevet

Every tree on the face of the earth will die sometime. There is risk involved with any tree by a target. At the end of the day it doesn't matter what you think should be done, it comes down to how much risk they are willing to live with in exchange for what they feel they get in return. That tree may not fall apart in their lifetime, then again it may. If they decide to keep the tree based on these factors and you have decided otherwise you will be looking for the next job to pay your bills.

I have done massive amounts of work involving lightning strikes. I have suggested removal, client opted otherwise and 5 hours later the tree fell on their house. I have also seen trees such as this that is very healthy in an extremely conducive environment not fall apart as it was a very good compartmentalizer and decay did not win the battle. Mitigating treatments are usually necessary though such as weight reduction pruning. Doesn't appear that cabling is an option as opposites do not seem to be available. I would begin with a climbing or aerial inspection to check for fractures or decay from previous topping and if HO says lightning strike was recent I would probably wait to see if anymore of tree will die.

AlysseR

Rather than start a new thread, I thought I'd post my somewhat similar question here.

Background info that might help:

We're in Central Florida, in the USA, and in an urban (suburban?) environment on a little lake that's still in fairly good health. Our house was built in the late 80's and there were probably grade changes that reduced (or covered) root flare -- can't quite tell how much ... 3-6" maybe?

The situation:

12 days ago our live oak (approximately 75 years old, 42" DBH & 43" Caliper) was hit by lightening. It looks as if it skinned a bit of bark (small amounts) down both leads of the tree. Just little scars from what we can see at ground level. But the lower it came, the bigger the damage. It ran, primarily, down the co-dominant north leader, but ty the time it reached the main trunk "skinned" turned into "peeled". The picture shows the worst side of the tree. The opposite didn't loose any attached bark, but the older bark that was loose came off and exposed an under-layer of bark (I didn't know that trees had multiple layers of bark -- that was cool to learn, but scary to see -- the new layer just looks "fresher" and it appears to be solidly attached).

We know that oaks compartmentalize well, but called ISA certified arborists right away, to see if there was anything we could do to help up the odds in the tree's favor. Aside from the fact that it's just a beautiful living thing, it's in our front yard and provides fantastic shade.

It's taken some time to get the arborists out and each has a slightly different story / suggestion. The first ones would were the the ones who couldn't produce membership cards but were ready to cut that day. (No surprise there!) We ignored them.

The second batch said the tree had a 50/50 chance and recommended bark tracing and either light fertilization of the drip area or deep root fertilization. Both were into painting the tree's wound -- which I'd thought was a bad thing? -- but was told was necessary to keep the bugs out.

The third batch said the tree had a 75+/25- chance of making it. One recommended waiting a month or two to see what would happen and then decide. (Makes sense, saves $, probably true )

The second, who was the most "papered" (arborist, tree specialist, etc) spoke of putting the bark back up against the tree, bungee cording it on -- not that it would grow back ... but that it would form a natural barrier and minimize the places where bugs could enter. He was adamantly opposed to painting the tree with anything and recommended against bark tracing stating, if I remember correctly, that it was not the latest / best technique available. He suggested, among other things, air spading to find the flare, root pruning (there was one bad mushroom - ganglia something - on the far side of the sidewalk that spelled potential trouble), and using a micro-tree-injection and cambistat. Then, wait and see. Maybe it'll help, maybe it won't.

And, if it isn't clear by now, this is the guy we favor. Partly because of his certifications, partly because he communicates well, partly because he says the things we want to hear. Nobody, by the way, promises success. (We wouldn't have hired them if they did. )

Somebody, somewhere along the way, I can't remember who, said buy cheap bug spray and spray the wound (where we can reach it) periodically. (Not as a total preventative / treatment, but as a "it can't hurt in addition to".)

I'm just looking for feedback -- pros & cons.

... pix won't go through, will try to send later

gavin160

R u crazy Tree or a life !