House crushers !! ?

friendly-tree

My neighbour thinks these trees were planted too close together and might fall over. They are about 60 ft tall and the two inner most trees are not as green and robust looking as the outer bigger trees. If they fall , they will do damage, but I really hope they are fine . What do you think ? Thanks !

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Eric Frei

Too hard to tell without a site visit, nasty included codominant stems in one pic.

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Brent Ferris

I expect the trees are ok -- the outside ones are growing bigger with more light, and no competition on one side, vs the two inner trees with competition both ways. I expect the radial growth of the inside trees to be much less than the outside trees, so the wood will be denser. THe likelihood of any of them falling over is minimal, but, removing the two smaller trees will allow the outside trees to grow a lot better and remain healthier longer,

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friendly-tree

I will have a few estimates done , and I don't like the looks of that codominant either. Would it split in half in a wind storm right where the tree splices into two? Is this a good case to get the trees topped halfway down? At least at half the height they would not pose as much risk to the adjacent houses and people.

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friendly-tree

The larger siamese twin tree on the far right has a lot of pine cones. Does a lot of pine cones mean the tree is dying ?

Eric Frei

Now you're confusing me.

These aren't the same tree are they?

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friendly-tree

The top picture is the left tree , and the bottom pic is the right tree. The total count is 2 skinny ones in the middle and two outer ones that split into two each, so six in total.

Eric Frei

I think you need an arborist onsite to help decide with those co-dominants. Topping the tree sucks, maybe some through bolts/cabling would do the trick and selective pruning.

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Darrell Mcleod

I copied the top picture in Eric's post #6 above; zoomed in and had a peak

In the red circle these codominants appear to be cracking down the trunk

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Brent Ferris

These codominants (that Cruisin_long referred to) are either cracking down the trunk or grew vey close together. THese could be in danger of splitting. THe rounded union you showed has a low risk.

There are a lot of laypeople that seem to think topping a tree is the way to go to reduce the risk of wind damage, It is not. Trees are genetically disposed to reach a certain height. Topping trees tells the tree the first shoot couldn't make it, so send up 5 or 6 shoots to replace the one and keep on growing. So if you thought the top was heavy, and swayed a lot in the wind -- which is normal for trees -- just imagine having 5-6 times that volume at the top -- that is when the tree is likely to lose its top.
So, DO NOT TOP.

I think that should be clear enough,.

If you are worried about the trees growing tall, we should really identify the trees. 60 feet is short for spruce trees in Toronto, they can reach 100-120 feet. So a pic of the needles would help for ID. When you find out how high they can grow, you can prob rest easy, even if your neighbour can't.

A lot of cones usually means there was abundant water the previous year or two depending on whether these trees generate cones over 1 year or 2. The amount of water allows flowers to live, and cones (fruit) to develop -- ie no drought. In the Toronto area, we had a lot of rain last year, and many of the spruce -- in particular -- have very heavy crops of cones this year. THe other conifers do as well, but Toronto has a preponderance of spruce species. If the tree were dying, the foliage would be very thin and ratty looking. Your trees appear to be vibrant.

__________________
My business: Tree Pruning and Removals -- Strump Removals -- Advice -- Consulting -- Arborist Reports
If you want an honest opinion, call Brent Ferris...because, Trees want to Live Too !
We do great jobs, even in small yards.

Free Estimates Oakville to Oshawa - North to Bradford (Will travel further if cost of travelling covered)

friendly-tree

Here is some close ups of the needles , and of the split. If the tree split at the trunk , my house or the neighbours would get the top 20 or so feet of tree.

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Darrell Mcleod

Included bark me thinks

Brent Ferris

Looks like Western Hemlock (Tsuga heterophylla ) - should be able to reach a height of 120-150 feet. Yours are still short.

As Cruisin_long suggests, included bark is highly probable between the two stems that grew up beside each other. Cabling and/or bolting should help to minimize splitting. Topping is not an option.

__________________
My business: Tree Pruning and Removals -- Strump Removals -- Advice -- Consulting -- Arborist Reports
If you want an honest opinion, call Brent Ferris...because, Trees want to Live Too !
We do great jobs, even in small yards.

Free Estimates Oakville to Oshawa - North to Bradford (Will travel further if cost of travelling covered)

bill24

An observation or two, the first is that the trees aren't to many years off affecting the fence and were planted to close to the fence in the first place, and the second somewhat obvious one is that the owner may learn from these trees and plant something more suitable in size in future.

(Not being over critical but see the wrong tree in the wrong place on a daily basis as I remove them or the stump.)

Can't see the roots all around the trees, are they affecting any nearby buildings, concrete slabs or paths.?

One view is, and not necessarily right, is that the longer they stay the bigger the job (expense) to remove them.

Is it strategically better for the owner to remove completely now and get something more suitable growing ?

Interested in opinions.

Eric Frei

120' to 150' tall and they're only 60' now.

How far is all this from houses again?

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MoDirt

Your trees were not planted to close together. They grew that way naturally.
Your Hemlocks are native and spread by seed.
If they were planted it would have been in like the 1870's, it looks like at least a 20'' DBH. I see alot of co-dominent stems on Hemlocks in Vancouver, mabye close to 15% on old growth. Not many need thinning , not many get reduced and if you must top just pay the guy to work his way down to the ground and get it over with.
They are most likely part of a native stand that was cut down to make room for homes and roads. If this is the case they will already be unstable and the best bet would be to get a Certified Arborist in for a Tree risk assessment. 'Tsuga heterophylla' do pretty well here in Vancouver storms, I see more wind damage from Firs in the Lower Mainland than I do Hemlocks, mostly small debris,foliage and cones. It does as well in the wind as its cousin 'Tsuga canadensis' which sits exposed on high cliffs and gets friken pounded by wind.

Make sure your neighbour is not trying to trick you into cutting down your trees so he can get more light in his yard, or a better view

If you do choose to remove 1 or 2 to thin them out don't grind the stumps. This will for sure create an unstable footing.

trees looks good to me, if it looks brown with cones, call a Certified Arborist

Brent Ferris

What is your objection- concern MoDirt with a large number of cones?

__________________
My business: Tree Pruning and Removals -- Strump Removals -- Advice -- Consulting -- Arborist Reports
If you want an honest opinion, call Brent Ferris...because, Trees want to Live Too !
We do great jobs, even in small yards.

Free Estimates Oakville to Oshawa - North to Bradford (Will travel further if cost of travelling covered)

MoDirt

For a large amount of cones, no real concern.

If the evergreen is Brown with cones it could be a sign of Flagging'. As in under a large amount of stress and is attempting to ensure its own survival.
As mentioned from a previous poster most likely a result of water, be it to much or to little. There are no pests that would cause stresses like such on a Tsuga in the lower mainland less a few Landscapers with a chip on their shoulder.
The stress could have even come from the fence which was built recently, a 110 year old ceder fence tends to fall apart.

I would say 'IT IS FLAGGING' but then again I can't see it in a picture,just taking the homeowners word that it is producing more cones than usual, best to call a Certified Arborist.

Though Hemlocks do produce alot of cones.

Or a could say " oh you see Brown. CUT ER DOWN EH! Yeah a could do it for 75 bucks and a case of Beer but you would need to pick me up from a bus stop. Where do you live again. Do you mind night pruning?

friendly-tree

How much does cabling a tree like this cost, and what does a job like that involve? The root system does not appear to be affecting anything at this point , and that fence is about 8 years old.
Does the cracking in the 'included bark ' mean that the tree is weak in the crotch of the co-dominant stem? I will call i a certified guy to come over and give me the low down on our tall friends.

Brent Ferris

The cracking suggests there is no interconnectivity of wood tissue between the stems, so if a strong wind blows too hard on one it will fall away, exposing the wood of the second stem. WHile they have not grown together, such close quarters would have squashed the life out of any bark between them,

Cabling can best be done and priced by a local arb.

__________________
My business: Tree Pruning and Removals -- Strump Removals -- Advice -- Consulting -- Arborist Reports
If you want an honest opinion, call Brent Ferris...because, Trees want to Live Too !
We do great jobs, even in small yards.

Free Estimates Oakville to Oshawa - North to Bradford (Will travel further if cost of travelling covered)

friendly-tree

Had one guy do a quick look, and he said approx. $800 to remove the one codominant tree , unless a certified arborist says bolting and cabling would work . It would cost approx. $400 to bolt and cable the one tree. He is sure that the trees grew into co-dominants because they were topped many years ago.

MoDirt

$800 seems ok, if he is spiking up to remove 1 co-dominant,but I can't see the whole site so I won't touch that one.

I don't see how a 'Tsuga hetrophylla' would sucker like that after topping.

How old is your home? Can you see any cut marks from when it was apparently topped?

I don't think it was ever topped. Tsuga's tend to get double leaders in tight stands. Even if it was topped in 1920 you would see evidence. There are a few company's in Vancouver that can help and will offer free estimates and assessments. They are larger companies and even if you choose to not use them get the free estimate. In fact if they all offer free estimates "CALL THEM ALL" you will be surprised what you learn from them.
You will save money by having them pile the blocks, get them to take the branches but keep the blocks. Then pay your neighbours kid 25 bucks to split them up,should be about 2.5 cords. Then sell or give away on CraigsList.You could probably make 140 bucks back(if its split).

friendly-tree

My house was built in '75, and I couldn't see any cut marks . Great idea about the blocks , if I ever had to take it down.

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