Equipment Q&A:

StrictlyPalms · 9th January 2008, 05:07 PM

Hey guys/gals,
So I'm looking to get some exercise in this winter and the local climbing gym seems like one of the better places since it will give me much needed practice and knowledge. But in looking at the gear it seems there is some really different sets depending on what kind of climbing is being done.

My main questions:

-I have no gear/experience in climbing, would it be better to rent/or just buy a set for rock walls?

-Or would the gym's let me use something more for tree work?

-What basic climbing gear crosses over from one to the other?

-Also, is it possible to do any sort of solo stuff in the back yard off one of my trees to get a decent workout in? (38 years old, working computers for the last 9 years hasn't done my stamina (or waistline) any good. In reading many of the threads out there it sounds like "air humping?" would be a good workout. Or is everything strictly 2 person for safety.

Any help for an FNG would be great. I'm studying like mad to try for the ISA cert this spring and definitely want to learn to do this stuff right.

SP

treekiwi · 9th January 2008, 05:28 PM

footlocking is definately one of the best workouts and can be done in your home tree, some of the boys used 2 use a rope bag full of weight to get the strength up

, as for at the rock climbing gym, Its usually cheap to hire gear from the club. Your arborist gear is definately no good for this and works on a completey different principle(would be nice if you could tho). Arborist harnesses are purely 'work positioning harnesses' which means they are designed for a fall of no more than 1.5-3 metres, which isnt much and arnt rated for recreation. Also its prity hard to climb a wall in a harness with a seat lol. Also the rope we used is semi or static line which means it has noor very little stretch and so is dangerous for falling great heights as apposed to 'dynamic' rope used in rock climbing which absorbs energy in the fall.... hope this helps.

Therrin · 9th January 2008, 08:00 PM

I'd have to agree with TreeKiwi...

I actually use my rock harness for pruning though, arbo harnesses are pretty restrictive.

I'd suggest purchasing your own harness, at the very least. "one-size-fits-all" and rented harnesses generally aren't as comfy as one that you go out and fit to yourself. Plus, since I own my own climbing harness, I know exactly what kind of falls it's taken, and I do the inspections on it. Personally I'd never rent a harness, but that's just me. You can pick up a good one from Petzl or Black Diamond for somewhere around $100 bucks. It'd be the best investment you can make as a climber (in either climbing world)

shaggs · 9th January 2008, 09:36 PM

G'day Strictly Palms
I'd stay away from any rented gear or second hand gear. Pay the dollars and get the new gear with no unknown history. Same for ropes, crabs etc.
Good to see your gong to look after your fittness. Alot of accidents occur when climbers are tired, or late in the day with "last cut syndrome".
Good Luck

newguy18 · 10th January 2008, 05:58 PM

Get the tree climbers companion and the fundamentals of general tree work they will be of great aid to you.you can get them both here.
A Tree Story: books and videos by Gerald F Beranek

StrictlyPalms · 10th January 2008, 07:27 PM

I have the companion but wanted to work through the ISA workbook at least once before I cracked another unknown. I appreciate the info you guys are giving, it really gives me some foreknowledge of what I'm getting into.

SP

newguy18 · 10th January 2008, 08:40 PM

Jerry 's book is one of the bestI've read and it"ll help you out on the isa.i have the official isa study guide but I got more out of jerry's book.

treevet · 14th January 2008, 03:36 PM

Most climbers I know work out to climb, not climb to get in shape. You can find yourself in a position where you don t have the fitness to power yourself out of it and get in trouble. Especially with your desk jockey job you might want to pump some weights and maybe hit the road for some mileage running prior to climbing. Climbing will find the weakest link in your body. Smart thing is not to have any.

TREEMONKEY · 14th January 2008, 05:23 PM

I have been rock climbing for 13 years and trees only 4. If you are not in the trees the best work out i find is bouldering(low angle rock climbing) and skipping in between and at home chin up pyramids 1 chin up 45 second break 2 chin ups 45 second break and follow that to 10 chin ups and then back down to one if that gets easy start at 5 and go to 15. bouldering is great exercise builds super strong core, back, and grip strength and no rope so you can keep climbing instead of coming down and untying and tying knots. Climb with other people at rock gyms they can teach you a lot of technique which will help you get strong.

Good Luck
Climb Hard Climb Safe

DBS · 14th January 2008, 06:05 PM

Here is a GREAT 9 week outline of a workout

Navy Seal Workout

It is in preparation to be a Navy Seal.

It requires a tremendous amount of discipline, but the results are phenomenal!!

Swimming is included down below, however there was a substitute for the swimming if NA, i just cant recall what it was.

Running

Weeks #1, 2: 2 miles/day, 8:30 pace, M/W/F (6 miles/ week)

Week #3: No running. High risk of stress fractures

Week #4: 3 miles/day, M/W/F (9 miles/wk)

Weeks #5, 6: 2/3/4/2 miles, M/Tu/Th/F (11 miles/wk)

Weeks #7,8: 4/4/5/3 miles, M/Tu/Th/F (16 miles/ wk)

Week #9: same as #7,8 (16 miles/ wk)

Push Ups, Pull Ups and Sit Ups (Mon/Wed/Fri)

Week #1:
4X15 Push Ups
4X20 Sit Ups
3X3 Pull Ups

Week #2:
5X20 Push Ups
5X20 Sit Ups
3X3 Pull Ups

Week #3,4:
5X25 Push Ups
5X25 Sit Ups
3X4 Pull Ups

Week #5,6:
6X25 Push Ups
6X25 Sit Ups
2X8 Pull Ups

Week #7,8:
6X30 Push Ups
6X30 Sit Ups
2X10 Pull Ups

Week #9:
6X30 Push Ups
6X30 Sit Ups
3X10 Pull Ups

Swimming 4-5 days a week

Weeks #1, 2: Swim continuously for 15 min.

Weeks #3, 4: Swim continuously for 20 min.

Weeks #5, 6: Swim continuously for 25 min.

Weeks #7, 8: Swim continuously for 30 min.

Week #9: Swim continuously for 35 min.

Be mentally strong, don't give up!

If you follow the program above exactly you will get great results and a new stronger you will emerge.

Be sure to take in enough nutrients and water.

I hope it doesn't scare you too much. Don't be intimidated by it. the running can be scary looking but work your way up to it!

Good Luck with it!!......

-Daryl

StrictlyPalms · 14th January 2008, 06:32 PM

Thanks DBS, that workout looks like it would fit my current schedule perfectly, I travel for a living so a "no equipment" workout is great. And I have access to the hotel pools whenever I need.

Trevet- I hear what you're saying, trust me I won't be getting into any trees or other situations without proper training and education. But I'm very interested in the climbing all the way around and it seems like, as a workout, it's the perfect way to train and exercise at the same time. I'm old enough to know my limitations.

Since I travel I'll be looking for climbing gyms around the country to keep things going. Also, some of the riggers on the show I work have promised to teach me some basic rappelling techniques.

Click the link for the cities I'll be in this year with the Professional Bull Rider's tour
Professional Bull Riders, Inc. Built Ford Tough Series
Unfortunately they canceled the Sao Paulo Brazil trip

Let me know if I'll be in a city near you!

treevet · 14th January 2008, 06:51 PM

Good thought, "a man s got to know his limitations" Clint Eastwood, Dirty Harry

quercus · 15th January 2008, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treekiwi

footlocking is definately one of the best workouts and can be done in your home tree, some of the boys used 2 use a rope bag full of weight to get the strength up

, as for at the rock climbing gym, Its usually cheap to hire gear from the club. Your arborist gear is definately no good for this and works on a completey different principle(would be nice if you could tho). Arborist harnesses are purely 'work positioning harnesses' which means they are designed for a fall of no more than 1.5-3 metres, which isnt much and arnt rated for recreation. Also its prity hard to climb a wall in a harness with a seat lol. Also the rope we used is semi or static line which means it has noor very little stretch and so is dangerous for falling great heights as apposed to 'dynamic' rope used in rock climbing which absorbs energy in the fall.... hope this helps.

I personally feel this post is all but helpfull...A few reasons...

1)A rock climbing harness is certainly not designed for tree work because it is very very uncomfortable after hanging into it for a longer period of time.Arb harnesses are certainly not only for work positioning. I do agree that there are different models, but it certainly possible to buy a harness that fits for all purposes.Petzl has a few good saddles, but keep in mind that a harness with a seat is not allways for tree-care purposes.

2)In tree-care, it is imperative that you don't have slack in your climbing system.Always try to keep it stretched. If you don't have slack on your climbing line, a fall can easily be stopped safely by a semi-static rope. By using a dynamic rope you will lose a great deal of efficiency when climbing trees because there is a lot of stretch in the line. Dynamic rock climbing lines have a thin outer liner. And they are not keeping their round shape very good. You'll come to find that it's very annoying when a dynamic rock climbing line is used with a hitch or prussik knot.

jim1nz · 16th January 2008, 02:26 AM

Hey whats your guys oppinions on this;

Using a tree work harness for rock climbing...

Apart from the obvious bulk, weight and movement issues i reckon you would be better off falling into a tree work harness as opposed to a little flimsy rock climbing harness.

Rock climbing harness dont even have padding or if so very little, compared to for example a tree motion harness.

I realise they are both rated to a min of 22kn and that YOU would probably break before the harness but what are thoughts anyway...

Therrin · 16th January 2008, 05:21 AM

I'd by far trust a good-sized fall in my rock harness. Just for some reason, I feel safer in it for a dynamic fall. The entire thing is "parachute grade" stitched. Just feels nice and secure.

The arbo harness is comfy, but I really don't have that same warm fuzzy feeling when I look at the big leather pieecs and wide stitches and buckles and such. I think they're primarily designed for different purposes, so it's hard to compare them, but I still like pruing with my rock harness better.

And Yes, Quercus, it is much more uncomfortable, compared to my tree harness, but I feel much more agile, so I accept the trade. I spent my first several years in trees, using a rock harness. Cruisin now though.... in comfort mostly.

newguy18 · 16th January 2008, 06:45 AM

I don't care for harnesses with a seat on them they restrict movement to much.

quercus · 16th January 2008, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jim1nz

Hey whats your guys oppinions on this;

Using a tree work harness for rock climbing...

Apart from the obvious bulk, weight and movement issues i reckon you would be better off falling into a tree work harness as opposed t

9th January 2008, 05:07 PM	#1 (permalink)
StrictlyPalms Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Orlando, Florida USA Posts: 125	Equipment Q&A: Hey guys/gals, So I'm looking to get some exercise in this winter and the local climbing gym seems like one of the better places since it will give me much needed practice and knowledge. But in looking at the gear it seems there is some really different sets depending on what kind of climbing is being done. My main questions: -I have no gear/experience in climbing, would it be better to rent/or just buy a set for rock walls? -Or would the gym's let me use something more for tree work? -What basic climbing gear crosses over from one to the other? -Also, is it possible to do any sort of solo stuff in the back yard off one of my trees to get a decent workout in? (38 years old, working computers for the last 9 years hasn't done my stamina (or waistline) any good. In reading many of the threads out there it sounds like "air humping?" would be a good workout. Or is everything strictly 2 person for safety. Any help for an FNG would be great. I'm studying like mad to try for the ISA cert this spring and definitely want to learn to do this stuff right. SP __________________ Strictly Palms, Inc. Orlando, Florida USA Last edited by StrictlyPalms : 9th January 2008 at 05:08 PM. Reason: didn't like the layout of my questions

9th January 2008, 05:28 PM	#2 (permalink)
treekiwi Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: New Zealand Posts: 103	Re: Equipment Q&A: footlocking is definately one of the best workouts and can be done in your home tree, some of the boys used 2 use a rope bag full of weight to get the strength up , as for at the rock climbing gym, Its usually cheap to hire gear from the club. Your arborist gear is definately no good for this and works on a completey different principle(would be nice if you could tho). Arborist harnesses are purely 'work positioning harnesses' which means they are designed for a fall of no more than 1.5-3 metres, which isnt much and arnt rated for recreation. Also its prity hard to climb a wall in a harness with a seat lol. Also the rope we used is semi or static line which means it has noor very little stretch and so is dangerous for falling great heights as apposed to 'dynamic' rope used in rock climbing which absorbs energy in the fall.... hope this helps.

9th January 2008, 08:00 PM	#3 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,282	Re: Equipment Q&A: I'd have to agree with TreeKiwi... I actually use my rock harness for pruning though, arbo harnesses are pretty restrictive. I'd suggest purchasing your own harness, at the very least. "one-size-fits-all" and rented harnesses generally aren't as comfy as one that you go out and fit to yourself. Plus, since I own my own climbing harness, I know exactly what kind of falls it's taken, and I do the inspections on it. Personally I'd never rent a harness, but that's just me. You can pick up a good one from Petzl or Black Diamond for somewhere around $100 bucks. It'd be the best investment you can make as a climber (in either climbing world) __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

9th January 2008, 09:36 PM	#4 (permalink)
shaggs Mature tree Join Date: May 2007 Location: sydney Posts: 464	Re: Equipment Q&A: G'day Strictly Palms I'd stay away from any rented gear or second hand gear. Pay the dollars and get the new gear with no unknown history. Same for ropes, crabs etc. Good to see your gong to look after your fittness. Alot of accidents occur when climbers are tired, or late in the day with "last cut syndrome". Good Luck

10th January 2008, 05:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,740	Re: Equipment Q&A: Get the tree climbers companion and the fundamentals of general tree work they will be of great aid to you.you can get them both here. A Tree Story: books and videos by Gerald F Beranek __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

10th January 2008, 07:27 PM	#6 (permalink)
StrictlyPalms Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Orlando, Florida USA Posts: 125	Re: Equipment Q&A: I have the companion but wanted to work through the ISA workbook at least once before I cracked another unknown. I appreciate the info you guys are giving, it really gives me some foreknowledge of what I'm getting into. SP __________________ Strictly Palms, Inc. Orlando, Florida USA

10th January 2008, 08:40 PM	#7 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,740	Re: Equipment Q&A: Jerry 's book is one of the bestI've read and it"ll help you out on the isa.i have the official isa study guide but I got more out of jerry's book. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

14th January 2008, 03:36 PM	#8 (permalink)
treevet Veteran Heritage Status Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA Posts: 1,123	Re: Equipment Q&A: Most climbers I know work out to climb, not climb to get in shape. You can find yourself in a position where you don t have the fitness to power yourself out of it and get in trouble. Especially with your desk jockey job you might want to pump some weights and maybe hit the road for some mileage running prior to climbing. Climbing will find the weakest link in your body. Smart thing is not to have any.

14th January 2008, 05:23 PM	#9 (permalink)
TREEMONKEY Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: ONTARIO, CANADA Posts: 96	Re: Equipment Q&A: I have been rock climbing for 13 years and trees only 4. If you are not in the trees the best work out i find is bouldering(low angle rock climbing) and skipping in between and at home chin up pyramids 1 chin up 45 second break 2 chin ups 45 second break and follow that to 10 chin ups and then back down to one if that gets easy start at 5 and go to 15. bouldering is great exercise builds super strong core, back, and grip strength and no rope so you can keep climbing instead of coming down and untying and tying knots. Climb with other people at rock gyms they can teach you a lot of technique which will help you get strong. Good Luck Climb Hard Climb Safe

14th January 2008, 06:05 PM	#10 (permalink)
DBS Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: CT USA Posts: 208	Re: Equipment Q&A: Here is a GREAT 9 week outline of a workout Navy Seal Workout It is in preparation to be a Navy Seal. It requires a tremendous amount of discipline, but the results are phenomenal!! Swimming is included down below, however there was a substitute for the swimming if NA, i just cant recall what it was. Running Weeks #1, 2: 2 miles/day, 8:30 pace, M/W/F (6 miles/ week) Week #3: No running. High risk of stress fractures Week #4: 3 miles/day, M/W/F (9 miles/wk) Weeks #5, 6: 2/3/4/2 miles, M/Tu/Th/F (11 miles/wk) Weeks #7,8: 4/4/5/3 miles, M/Tu/Th/F (16 miles/ wk) Week #9: same as #7,8 (16 miles/ wk) Push Ups, Pull Ups and Sit Ups (Mon/Wed/Fri) Week #1: 4X15 Push Ups 4X20 Sit Ups 3X3 Pull Ups Week #2: 5X20 Push Ups 5X20 Sit Ups 3X3 Pull Ups Week #3,4: 5X25 Push Ups 5X25 Sit Ups 3X4 Pull Ups Week #5,6: 6X25 Push Ups 6X25 Sit Ups 2X8 Pull Ups Week #7,8: 6X30 Push Ups 6X30 Sit Ups 2X10 Pull Ups Week #9: 6X30 Push Ups 6X30 Sit Ups 3X10 Pull Ups Swimming 4-5 days a week Weeks #1, 2: Swim continuously for 15 min. Weeks #3, 4: Swim continuously for 20 min. Weeks #5, 6: Swim continuously for 25 min. Weeks #7, 8: Swim continuously for 30 min. Week #9: Swim continuously for 35 min. Be mentally strong, don't give up! If you follow the program above exactly you will get great results and a new stronger you will emerge. Be sure to take in enough nutrients and water. I hope it doesn't scare you too much. Don't be intimidated by it. the running can be scary looking but work your way up to it! Good Luck with it!!...... -Daryl __________________ Stihl MS 200T Stihl MS 361

14th January 2008, 06:32 PM	#11 (permalink)
StrictlyPalms Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Orlando, Florida USA Posts: 125	Re: Equipment Q&A: Thanks DBS, that workout looks like it would fit my current schedule perfectly, I travel for a living so a "no equipment" workout is great. And I have access to the hotel pools whenever I need. Trevet- I hear what you're saying, trust me I won't be getting into any trees or other situations without proper training and education. But I'm very interested in the climbing all the way around and it seems like, as a workout, it's the perfect way to train and exercise at the same time. I'm old enough to know my limitations. Since I travel I'll be looking for climbing gyms around the country to keep things going. Also, some of the riggers on the show I work have promised to teach me some basic rappelling techniques. Click the link for the cities I'll be in this year with the Professional Bull Rider's tour Professional Bull Riders, Inc. Built Ford Tough Series Unfortunately they canceled the Sao Paulo Brazil trip Let me know if I'll be in a city near you! __________________ Strictly Palms, Inc. Orlando, Florida USA

14th January 2008, 06:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
treevet Veteran Heritage Status Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA Posts: 1,123	Re: Equipment Q&A: Good thought, "a man s got to know his limitations" Clint Eastwood, Dirty Harry

16th January 2008, 02:26 AM	#14 (permalink)
jim1nz Mature tree Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Tauranga, New Zealand Posts: 296	Re: Equipment Q&A: Hey whats your guys oppinions on this; Using a tree work harness for rock climbing... Apart from the obvious bulk, weight and movement issues i reckon you would be better off falling into a tree work harness as opposed to a little flimsy rock climbing harness. Rock climbing harness dont even have padding or if so very little, compared to for example a tree motion harness. I realise they are both rated to a min of 22kn and that YOU would probably break before the harness but what are thoughts anyway... __________________ SPEED ALWAYS FOLLOWS TECHNIQUE

16th January 2008, 05:21 AM	#15 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,282	Re: Equipment Q&A: I'd by far trust a good-sized fall in my rock harness. Just for some reason, I feel safer in it for a dynamic fall. The entire thing is "parachute grade" stitched. Just feels nice and secure. The arbo harness is comfy, but I really don't have that same warm fuzzy feeling when I look at the big leather pieecs and wide stitches and buckles and such. I think they're primarily designed for different purposes, so it's hard to compare them, but I still like pruing with my rock harness better. And Yes, Quercus, it is much more uncomfortable, compared to my tree harness, but I feel much more agile, so I accept the trade. I spent my first several years in trees, using a rock harness. Cruisin now though.... in comfort mostly. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

16th January 2008, 06:45 AM	#16 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,740	Re: Equipment Q&A: I don't care for harnesses with a seat on them they restrict movement to much. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related