Building the Aussie GRCS

TrevMcRev · 2nd June 2007, 12:34 AM

Bought a winch today so time to get to designing/farbrication of a GRCS type system. THe fabricator can engineer the device using FEA, Finite Element Analysis. This is what is used to "test & measure" the effect of loads placed on an object in numerous ways as used to test safety in the design of rollcages. Im confident this will be as well, or better made than a GRCS.

I'd love feedback from anyone with experience with this device as to how they think it could be refined.

Eric Frei · 2nd June 2007, 07:29 AM

Here's some pics I left large.

Loaded with tips.

Jeff Darby · 2nd June 2007, 08:50 AM

Hi Trev,
Use alloy grade steel it will be lighter and stronger,and the points Ekka made are good aswell,maybe a small directional fairlead above the winch to minimise friction,it's a bit like reinventing the wheel but with the knowledge of actually using it first.Don't disregard the product being sold as the engineering has already been done for you just re inforce on that.

Jeff Darby · 9th June 2007, 07:38 PM

Hey Trev,
How's it going,have you started it yet?..If so...Where's the picy's.

TrevMcRev · 25th June 2007, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayD

Hey Trev,
How's it going,have you started it yet?..If so...Where's the picy's.

Not started on this but it is one of the next projects in line. Just had to put new sides in the truck canopy due to rust from the mulch and dismantle the stumphumper to repair a crack in the frame. When i get it back together i'll start on the TrevMcRev Tree Rigging System. We can call it the TTRS, and when you say it fast it sounds like ...........tittyrrse

So any other tips from users of similar friction/lifting devices that will help refine the design are welcome.

Jeff Darby · 27th June 2007, 11:36 AM

There's alway's something taking our time,maintenance sucks but you have to do it...me myself, I think re inventing the wheel will be hard, That's why I suggested re inforcing on whats already out there..like a work in progress..things you notice and say that would work better if I did it like this...etc.don't be afraid to change(modify things)as you go just keep a record of what you have done:eg build procedure,if you weld, welding procedure,size and tensile strenght of bolts,mounting rachet and strap max,min working load...bring the powers that be in on it they will tell you what they expect from you in the way of certification..and posibly stop you from making a costly mistake.It will be good to see the finnished product..but don't take to long to do it or I will beat you to it.Good luck with it Trev.

Mangoes · 11th October 2007, 02:31 PM

Thought I might bump this thread after all the excitement over a few wee little throwballs.

Eric Frei · 11th October 2007, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mangoes

Thought I might bump this thread after all the excitement over a few wee little throwballs.

So what are trying to do, copy the Aussie design or offer ideas?

Steve Tipton · 11th October 2007, 08:12 PM

Total Height Safety's Friction drum does me, and I'm quite capable of making my own.

Eric Frei · 11th October 2007, 08:24 PM

Yeah I've used them, I think Billy Goddard designed and builds them?

Steve Tipton · 11th October 2007, 09:53 PM

Bill designed them, i think he has an engineer build them. I'll ask him and let you know.

Eric Frei · 11th October 2007, 10:39 PM

Have you sat through one of his rigging sessions?

Pretty good, got some good log drop chart info, and a neat little model to show you winching up and slewing branches.

Hey, maybe he can put an ad up for here with a video and stuff.

TrevMcRev · 11th October 2007, 11:06 PM

I've used one of them. Good friction for big lowering. Not very efficient at lifting compared to a grcs.

Steve Tipton · 12th October 2007, 06:43 PM

Over the years I have done a lot of training with Bill. Rope walking, advanced rigging for removals and he has spent days with our crews and assessed and then trained them in various aspects of teamwork and efficiency.
I found it all paid dividends straight away.

Eric Frei · 12th October 2007, 07:08 PM

The man knows his stuff, you can tell.

Ace Master · 15th October 2007, 12:20 AM

The Bill Goddard friction drum and the GRCS system are all very good tree equipment, each one has a different speciality capabilties, the Bill Goddard unit is ideal for large downward forces, in a small compact friendly unit.The GRCS has a upward lifting force, and is a pull apart unit, so each one can do the same thing but have different outcomes.

TreeCo · 15th October 2007, 12:42 AM

I would like to see these devices designed so additional 10,000 lb. binders could easily be attached. The binder would not be part of the device, just carried along and used when needed. A projection off of the bottom of the device to catch a binder would be a good start.

George Hayduke · 18th November 2007, 07:03 AM

This just came to me...

There is a huge fuss over Weaver Leather copying the Harrison Rocket but no one has any problem copying the GRCS or Hobbs Device. This seems inconsistent...is it?

Eric Frei · 18th November 2007, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Hayduke

This just came to me...

There is a huge fuss over Weaver Leather copying the Harrison Rocket but no one has any problem copying the GRCS or Hobbs Device. This seems inconsistent...is it?

Check out this post.

Have Weaver Leather copied the Harrison rocket? You decide.

kimtree · 18th November 2007, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Hayduke

This just came to me...

There is a huge fuss over Weaver Leather copying the Harrison Rocket but no one has any problem copying the GRCS or Hobbs Device. This seems inconsistent...is it?

Fair enough, im not selling my device commercially

George Hayduke · 19th November 2007, 02:24 AM

The linked thread should have it's name changed.

WEAVER LEATHER has copied the Harrison Rocket NOT Sherrill. Put the stink where it belongs not on a vendor.

Eric Frei · 19th November 2007, 07:36 AM

Good point, done that!

shaggs · 19th November 2007, 08:45 AM

Yeah, not selling mine either.
I suppose where do you start though? Didn't land rover use capstans as winches on some of their vehicles? Fire brigades have been using them as lifting/lowering devices since the 1960's on their travel towers and ladder platforms, except they were puer brass!!!

Jeff Darby · 19th November 2007, 08:56 AM

Good piont George, It seems to me that the two throw bags are pretty much the same, But that's where it's stops, The devices that are appearing in this thread and, "New lifting /lowering Device thread, Only have one simularity and that's a buy off the shelf product everything else is somewhat differant, More than enought to circamgate patent, IMO, But I'm no expert here, I say let the ideas roll in, We all will benefit from the experience in the long run..I want to see Trev's idea probably as much as he wants to mine, and i've enjoyed seeing all the other efforts as well.First we have to get out of the trees,recover than get our ideas of the drawing board and into service and go from there.
All The Best
JayD

newguy18 · 19th November 2007, 02:46 PM

Has any manufacturer made a device that will handle a 7/8's double braid yet?
I know the grcs and hobbs will only handle a 3/4 double braid.
oh btw here is a rope company about 3 hours away from me.
Consolidated Cordage | commercial milspec rope cord twine bungee elastic nets
its good for general Idea on breaking strengths of rope.

kimtree · 19th November 2007, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Hayduke

This just came to me...

There is a huge fuss over Weaver Leather copying the Harrison Rocket but no one has any problem copying the GRCS or Hobbs Device. This seems inconsistent...is it?

prior to making my own device i did try and get a grcs from the usa via a supplier in Perth they wanted $7500 aus,absolute ripoff so i made my own cost all up about $2000

George Hayduke · 23rd November 2007, 04:09 PM

Can't you buy direct from a US vendor and pay for the shipping? That would eliminate at least one of the middlemen. Or...get hold of Greg Good for a direct sale.

I talked to two Aussies at the airport after TCIA Expo. They came to the show to buy a chipper and stump grinder. They made the deal and were heading back to Oz to make shipping arrangements. There plan was to have the chipper and stump grinder delivered to California. Then they would secure them in a shipping container. After the big iron was secured the rest of the space was going to be filled with ropes, saws and other gear. The savings they would realize by dealing direct would more than offset all of their travel expenses of two trips to the US. They were planning on selling off some of the supplies to make some walking around money as soon as the container was unloaded.

kimtree · 23rd November 2007, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Hayduke

Can't you buy direct from a US vendor and pay for the shipping? That would eliminate at least one of the middlemen. Or...get hold of Greg Good for a direct sale.

I talked to two Aussies at the airport after TCIA Expo. They came to the show to buy a chipper and stump grinder. They made the deal and were heading back to Oz to make shipping arrangements. There plan was to have the chipper and stump grinder delivered to California. Then they would secure them in a shipping container. After the big iron was secured the rest of the space was going to be filled with ropes, saws and other gear. The savings they would realize by dealing direct would more than offset all of their travel expenses of two trips to the US. They were planning on selling off some of the supplies to make some walking around money as soon as the container was unloaded.

i looked at this 2 years ago,with the exchange rate as it stands now it would certainly be doing what you suggest now

TrevMcRev · 16th May 2009, 09:16 PM

Well isn't it funny how quick nearly 2 years pass....

Anyway, i finally got round to building my winch!

For personal use only - these are not for sale!

Here it is:

Jeff Darby · 16th May 2009, 09:38 PM

Looks good Trev..

... What size winch and make??

2nd June 2007, 12:34 AM	#1
TrevMcRev Mature Tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 1,594	Building the Aussie GRCS Bought a winch today so time to get to designing/farbrication of a GRCS type system. THe fabricator can engineer the device using FEA, Finite Element Analysis. This is what is used to "test & measure" the effect of loads placed on an object in numerous ways as used to test safety in the design of rollcages. Im confident this will be as well, or better made than a GRCS. I'd love feedback from anyone with experience with this device as to how they think it could be refined.

2nd June 2007, 07:29 AM	#2
Eric Frei Admin - Owner Palm & Tree Services in Brisbane Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,986	Here's some pics I left large. Loaded with tips. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

2nd June 2007, 08:50 AM	#3
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,056	Hi Trev, Use alloy grade steel it will be lighter and stronger,and the points Ekka made are good aswell,maybe a small directional fairlead above the winch to minimise friction,it's a bit like reinventing the wheel but with the knowledge of actually using it first.Don't disregard the product being sold as the engineering has already been done for you just re inforce on that. __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

9th June 2007, 07:38 PM	#4
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,056	Hey Trev, How's it going,have you started it yet?..If so...Where's the picy's. __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

27th June 2007, 11:36 AM	#6
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,056	There's alway's something taking our time,maintenance sucks but you have to do it...me myself, I think re inventing the wheel will be hard, That's why I suggested re inforcing on whats already out there..like a work in progress..things you notice and say that would work better if I did it like this...etc.don't be afraid to change(modify things)as you go just keep a record of what you have done:eg build procedure,if you weld, welding procedure,size and tensile strenght of bolts,mounting rachet and strap max,min working load...bring the powers that be in on it they will tell you what they expect from you in the way of certification..and posibly stop you from making a costly mistake.It will be good to see the finnished product..but don't take to long to do it or I will beat you to it.Good luck with it Trev. __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

11th October 2007, 02:31 PM	#7
Mangoes Sappling Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: n/a Posts: 23	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Thought I might bump this thread after all the excitement over a few wee little throwballs. __________________ ?Perhaps a truer indication of mental illness?..can be found in the far more common tendency to passively accept the abuse of the very systems that keep us alive.? - John Vaillant; The Golden Spruce

11th October 2007, 08:12 PM	#9
Steve Tipton Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 821	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Total Height Safety's Friction drum does me, and I'm quite capable of making my own.

11th October 2007, 08:24 PM	#10
Eric Frei Admin - Owner Palm & Tree Services in Brisbane Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,986	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Yeah I've used them, I think Billy Goddard designed and builds them? __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

11th October 2007, 09:53 PM	#11
Steve Tipton Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 821	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Bill designed them, i think he has an engineer build them. I'll ask him and let you know.

11th October 2007, 10:39 PM	#12
Eric Frei Admin - Owner Palm & Tree Services in Brisbane Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,986	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Have you sat through one of his rigging sessions? Pretty good, got some good log drop chart info, and a neat little model to show you winching up and slewing branches. Hey, maybe he can put an ad up for here with a video and stuff. __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

11th October 2007, 11:06 PM	#13
TrevMcRev Mature Tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 1,594	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS I've used one of them. Good friction for big lowering. Not very efficient at lifting compared to a grcs.

12th October 2007, 06:43 PM	#14
Steve Tipton Over mature heritage tree Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 821	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Over the years I have done a lot of training with Bill. Rope walking, advanced rigging for removals and he has spent days with our crews and assessed and then trained them in various aspects of teamwork and efficiency. I found it all paid dividends straight away.

12th October 2007, 07:08 PM	#15
Eric Frei Admin - Owner Palm & Tree Services in Brisbane Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,986	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS The man knows his stuff, you can tell. __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

15th October 2007, 12:20 AM	#16
Ace Master Mature tree Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia, Vic, Melbourne Posts: 385	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS The Bill Goddard friction drum and the GRCS system are all very good tree equipment, each one has a different speciality capabilties, the Bill Goddard unit is ideal for large downward forces, in a small compact friendly unit.The GRCS has a upward lifting force, and is a pull apart unit, so each one can do the same thing but have different outcomes. __________________ Website: The Mt Dandenong Ranges Tree Specialists YouTube: Ace Tree Master

15th October 2007, 12:42 AM	#17
TreeCo Mature tree Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 307	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS I would like to see these devices designed so additional 10,000 lb. binders could easily be attached. The binder would not be part of the device, just carried along and used when needed. A projection off of the bottom of the device to catch a binder would be a good start.

18th November 2007, 07:03 AM	#18
George Hayduke Former Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Slickrock, USA Posts: 87	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS This just came to me... There is a huge fuss over Weaver Leather copying the Harrison Rocket but no one has any problem copying the GRCS or Hobbs Device. This seems inconsistent...is it?

19th November 2007, 02:24 AM	#21
George Hayduke Former Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Slickrock, USA Posts: 87	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS The linked thread should have it's name changed. WEAVER LEATHER has copied the Harrison Rocket NOT Sherrill. Put the stink where it belongs not on a vendor.

19th November 2007, 07:36 AM	#22
Eric Frei Admin - Owner Palm & Tree Services in Brisbane Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,986	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Good point, done that! __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

19th November 2007, 08:45 AM	#23
shaggs Mature tree Join Date: May 2007 Location: sydney Posts: 419	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Yeah, not selling mine either. I suppose where do you start though? Didn't land rover use capstans as winches on some of their vehicles? Fire brigades have been using them as lifting/lowering devices since the 1960's on their travel towers and ladder platforms, except they were puer brass!!!

19th November 2007, 08:56 AM	#24
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,056	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Good piont George, It seems to me that the two throw bags are pretty much the same, But that's where it's stops, The devices that are appearing in this thread and, "New lifting /lowering Device thread, Only have one simularity and that's a buy off the shelf product everything else is somewhat differant, More than enought to circamgate patent, IMO, But I'm no expert here, I say let the ideas roll in, We all will benefit from the experience in the long run..I want to see Trev's idea probably as much as he wants to mine, and i've enjoyed seeing all the other efforts as well.First we have to get out of the trees,recover than get our ideas of the drawing board and into service and go from there. All The Best JayD __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

19th November 2007, 02:46 PM	#25
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: orlando,fl Posts: 4,948	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Has any manufacturer made a device that will handle a 7/8's double braid yet? I know the grcs and hobbs will only handle a 3/4 double braid. oh btw here is a rope company about 3 hours away from me. Consolidated Cordage \| commercial milspec rope cord twine bungee elastic nets its good for general Idea on breaking strengths of rope. __________________ Have your say join us today. old schooler

23rd November 2007, 04:09 PM	#27
George Hayduke Former Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Slickrock, USA Posts: 87	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Can't you buy direct from a US vendor and pay for the shipping? That would eliminate at least one of the middlemen. Or...get hold of Greg Good for a direct sale. I talked to two Aussies at the airport after TCIA Expo. They came to the show to buy a chipper and stump grinder. They made the deal and were heading back to Oz to make shipping arrangements. There plan was to have the chipper and stump grinder delivered to California. Then they would secure them in a shipping container. After the big iron was secured the rest of the space was going to be filled with ropes, saws and other gear. The savings they would realize by dealing direct would more than offset all of their travel expenses of two trips to the US. They were planning on selling off some of the supplies to make some walking around money as soon as the container was unloaded.

16th May 2009, 09:16 PM	#29
TrevMcRev Mature Tree Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Posts: 1,594	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Well isn't it funny how quick nearly 2 years pass.... Anyway, i finally got round to building my winch! For personal use only - these are not for sale! Here it is: Attached Thumbnails

16th May 2009, 09:38 PM	#30
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,056	Re: Building the Aussie GRCS Looks good Trev..... What size winch and make?? __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

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