Who's seen a clove hitch disaster?

Knotahippie

Couple years back a climber told me he had a big chunk (100lbs+) fall to the ground because the clove hitch "rolled out" and failed, even though it was backed up w/a half hitch.

Iv'e talk to alot of people who use the clove and never have problems...

Turns out the clove hitch is not designed for a lateral pull, but a horizontal pull.

On the other hand a rolling hitch is designed for both.

I have always use a "carabiner" knot to avoid this...never much liked the clove.

Any experiences/knots?

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newguy18

Nope,i have used the clove and chain hitch many times and never had them fail,had a running bowline slip once,dropped the limb right in a mans garden.

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old schooler

Knotahippie

Chain hitch is cool, I use it with a throwline to pull a climbline into the tree.

Carabiner is cool because it's fast. Two steel crabs are best.

Eric Frei

I use 72Kn biners, love my loops too, knotless technique, way cool.

I've heard of cloves rolling out but never had one, but I rarely use them.

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TrevMcRev

Clove hitches are best on smaller diameter say <10" stuff IMO.
100lb chunk was probly well over size.
Also depends which way you face the knot in relation to the loading applied.
Mix that up & it can roll out.

Choked slings are the go.

newguy18

I have to wonder if his frienf snuuged it down properly?Also did he use two half hitches or the bowline finish?

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old schooler

Knotahippie

He backed it up with one half hitch, it came crashing down 1ft. from a fence.

The piece was at about 20deg. angle, so it swung hard (as Jasper would say)

Bowline finish? That's a big cruise ship headded to Finland right?

dannyboysfc

Ive seen some huge pieces brought down with clove hitches, way bigger than 100 lbs, mostly by old school guys. It needs 2 half hitches and they need to be tied a particular way(cant remember off the top ot my head which it is as I dont use cloves much). I like bowline, or sometimes when taking multiple branches at one time I'll colve hitch 0ne or more, but the final piece is tied with a running bowline - even if the clove hitches roll they'll catch at the last piece.

Im starting to use slings more and more though, way fast and easy!

newguy18

No,you can finish a clove hitch with what is known as the bowline finish,it alllows both legs of the hitch share the load evenly.Don't you have the fundamentals of general treework?

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old schooler

Knotahippie

I just know Cheif Treework, he lives in the woods about a mile from here.

All I ever used is carabiners, never heard of the bowline finish.

How's it go?

newguy18

as your tieing the clove hitch,you impart a loop in the area you would normally tie yuo half hitches and tie it like a bowline.Do i need to play with paint?

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old schooler

Knotahippie

It's a cool lookin' knot, guess I missed that one.

Just used the half hitches...been daaays since I used the clove on anything but balance rig.

Angus

I receive almost nothing but clove hitches w. half hitch(es), and I've never seen one let go. Always struck me as a reliable and safe knot.

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Angus McMahon
Sherbrooke Tree Service

Knotahippie

Make sure it's a couple half hitches...It could roll out, trust me.

The ultimate encyclopedia of knots states "clove hitch is not designed for a lateral pull, but a horizontal pull only".

I rarely use the clove rock climbing either...anything with clove, devil or satan, I don't touch it.

OutofMytree

Hehehe.

This all sounds a bit weird to me. Do you guys really take out logs without using 'biners? I ahve never seen that done. Honest. I only ever use a simple screw lock karabiner on load bearing ropes.

Clove hitch is a great load locking knot when you add a half hitch to the top. Can't say as I have ever had one fail that way.

anuvadave

i was working on the ground a few years a ago for an experienced climber, I was lowering out a branch, not a huge branch but still big enough and high enough to do serious damage. Anyway the clove hich slipped off, I was holding the rope tight in my hands but the branch was still sailing thru the air coming right for me i was against a fence & had nowhere to run. I just managed to lean a bit out of the way & glanced it off with my forearms onto my thigh. everyone ran over & were all surprised nothing was broken - especially me! i had a corked leg & sore arms for about a week tho!
The climber said hed never seen it happen in 16yrs.
but theres a first time for everything.
I bought a helmet that afternoon, & a case of beer, wouldnt work without 1 now (the helmet i mean).

i prefer to use a small sling instead of the clove hitch - same setup as ive seen ekka use on his vidz. Ive only seen clove hitches come undone, never any other knot.

anuvadave

I think Graeme ties his clove hitch first, then half hitches the tail to the load part of the rope, this definately stops the knot rolling. I think you can run into problems when you tie a half hitch & then finish tying off with a clove hitch, pulling a clove hitch sideways really makes them want to unroll.

cuttenwolf

i have had the clove roll out once or twice both times I did not use the half hitch befor that has always been a staple since the last time I can remember i generally use the hitch befor every knot now anyway

Gunslinger

I've seen those endless rope loops in EKKA's and some other video's. Do they actually sell them? I've yet to see one in a catalog. I've end to end spliced one with a scrap piece of Stable Braid that I had but found that the shortest loop that I could make was about 10' in circumference due the the sliding back of the cover during the splicing process. How do you guys get them so short?