Types of Biners you use.

Eric Frei

Opening the gate is not a step, otherwise non lockers would be considered locking wouldn't they.

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newguy18

Actually Eric,opening the gate is considered a motion in triple lockers.
Slide,twist,open.

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Therrin

Like I said, it doesnt make sense to me either Eric.

The "opening" movement isnt a lock-step. Because in that position it isnt "locked", it can just be pushed open. I thought that true "triple" lockers had 3 separate locking movements *before* you opened the gate. Slide-twist-slide-open. That would be 3 "locks", not just 3 motions.

Eric Frei

I agree Therrin, the opening of the gate is not a step.

I have dual locking biners, twist lift or lift twist then open, the opening of the gate is not a step.

There's a lot of confusion with this as what we say and what rec rock climbers say and what ANSI says etc vary.

Ansi says there must be two distinct motion before the gate can be opened.

So over the last 10 years there's been a terminolgy change, many so called tri-locks are just dual-locks, but new proper tri-locks have been born, that means 3 distinct motions before a gate opens .... which is a fair wad really.

Now, can anyone spark my memory about this occurrence recently (please post a link if you can). I'm sure some-one took a fall where (and recommended by many "guru's") a flip attachment to the saddle of a biner was replaced by a mallion. The idea being that mallions are tightened with pliers and it stays there pretty much permanent.

Anyway, it came undone and a fall resulted.

So WTF are people replacing biners for with screw gate mallions? What's the difference then in tightening your screw gate with pliers? At least with a screw gate I can check it easier than a stupid mallion.

Over here at Aborcamp 2004 they were near on forcing people to switch to mallions for their flip lines fixed saddle attachment end. Some wankers have their way they'll force you to face a certain direction when taking a crap and which hand to wipe ya ass with!

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Q.Q.

Hmm funny you menshoned that Ekka,the last Arbor camp 2008 I had tripple lock biners on my flip attachments and the guy that inspected my harness made me take them off and go and get two mallions before I could climb.
Also said one harness was no good, so left it out as well,and some steel biners tripple lock as well.
The other big point was HELMETS.There were a lot of people that to buy full strap helmets before we could climb including me.

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Gunslinger

Would one of these be considered acceptable for connecting the flip line to the saddle? The ring makes it impossible for the thing to unscrew even if it's loose.

Attached Thumbnails

 

(WLL)

i have used that for many years without the ring, and i have learned to trust it. i always inspect my gear before i enter the tree. i use almost all auto lockers climbing and rigging, however i also use non locking for redirects and a few other tasks. i like to use powdered lithium grease on the occasional sticky krab. dont be afraid to buy new krabs every now and again.

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(WLL)

wow, that store is a bit pricey.

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Therrin

Why buy them if you can get krabs from a friend?

Q.Q.

So howed you get rid of them Terrin?

Yeh I got those too but don 't like everything always attached.

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Therrin

How do I get rid of them? Easy, I give MINE to a friend when I've decided I dont want them anymore.


I'm still peeved that screw-locking biners arent "allowed" because too many people are too lazy to use them correctly. I've never had a screw locker gum up and stick on me or disfunction the way auto's have.

Angus

A late entry...

Regardless of whether you use an auto or screw gate, dogmatic self checking is far more important than the number of times a gate is screwed, or the finger yoga exercises needed to undo the auto.

We did a study on some of the auto's back in ~2000, and like every mechanical device, at some point, something will fail especially when there are springs involved.

Getting yourself into the habit of letting go of a biner (regardless of type) is a very bad habit. Unfortunately, auto lockers encourage this type of behaviour. Under normal conditions, the auto biner has taken care of your safety.

Honestly, how often after snapping your auto biner does a wave of self checks begin? How often do you look down, watch the biner snap, check it, double check it, then move onto your next set of checks? How often do you inspect your equipment for cracks or defects?

If you visually, and physically check your biner each time you close it, it won't matter whether your using screw gate or auto lockers - you've personally taken responsibility of your safety.

Alloy biners (screws and autos), under the right load or shock WILL jam. The same statement is true with steel, except 'the right load' is much higher.

Rigging with life support devices needs very careful management. There are many on this forum that do it safely, every day. The ones that don't are the ones that help generate (poor) statistics on the failures of our life support devices. I make a very clear distinction between biners and rigging devices - they are not the same, and they should not be treated the same.

Anyhow... just my two cents.

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Knotahippie

I concur.

I use autos nowadays but I like the price of screw gates.

When climbing on my own time I use 2 opposing screw gates.

Scobobbi

I have all kinds of biners. I use[I] steel for rigging and climbing and aluminium for climbing. I like the comment by Shagg, "all steel--all the time." I might have to think about going that way. I like the feel of the steel in the hand. I like the weight. I like how they take a banging. I recently picked up a couple new steelies and haven't had new ones in a long time. The new ones are the type that take two actions to open. Easier to do with one hand. And I live by the comment the kid made about the best policy being to always be checking your biners thoughout the operation. That is definately a baseline habit to go by. I have purposely given my entire setup a going over and found side loaded biners, twisted biners, biners with the screw gate open, biners crossed over other hardware and under load, etc. It is just a good way to operate. I usually will do the once over inspection during some kind of transition, like shifting a load from one system to another, or right after I move an anchor and lay out the lines to carry a load in another direction, but before letting a load into the system. That is when I would be getting a drink, taking a breather, etc. It is a good time to clear the head, enjoy the view, think about the big picture, and MIND YER LINES.

SERGIO

I find that "LIQUID WRENCH" is lasts longer than WD-40.

Therrin

Liquid Wrench on yer biners?? :yikes:
Wouldn't that attract a ton of grit and sawdust?

Knotahippie

There's a dry lube for bike chains that might work good.

SERGIO

You don't need to drown them in it & wipe off the ya don't want on there.

Therrin

I know I've used other stuff but I just realized that a tube of graphite may work as well. Like the kind you can get at any key&lock shop.

Straw

I use a steel auto locker to connect my climbing line to my harness, aluminum for lanyards and climbing redirects, steel for all rigging. Silicon spray lube to keep em working smoothly.

Straw

stirmantrees

i like petyl caribiners. aluminum. triple lock with the little ball you press to begin the 3 steps

Cole

i use all ISC alum quadlocks and tripple locks on my harness and for my flip line connector and i use petzl william and AMD william ball lock for my SRT set up. use screw gates for rigging use a petzl kador autolock for light stuff, do any of you guys who use screw gates rotate the biner 180 degree so that you screw the lock downwards

banner

triple auto locks for climbing attachments rated 5400+
screw type for rigging

I admit though I have used screwgates but stopped for good reason. And this is why they are not the best choice/not recommended.
How many times have you guys that climb with them, on ocassion have been up in the tree and noticed you neglected to screw the gate shut? Happened to me twice,sent chills down my spine, that was enough awaken me to the danger of human error involved when using them.

Using triple locking biners the odds of scenario occurring is reduced to near zero.

I never read this entire thread so If I'm repeating what someone else has already noted.....excuse me.

devo

i use isc autolock biners for both myself and rigging

terry

hi i use aluminiam screwgate for climbing and steal screwgate for rigging.

Crow Horse

I have no experience with biners, but a good lubricant like the "dry" Super Lube or PB's Dry lube might work well. I've used both on a variety of items and they lubricate well and aren't messy and don't stain.......

From their sites....

DRI-FILM Aerosol
Super Lube® DRI-FILM lubricant contains sub-micron sized particles of PTFE powder in a solvent base. When applied, the solvent carrier cleans and carries the dry lubricant powder to the components to be lubricated, then evaporates very rapidly, leaving behind a protective shield lubricant that will not attract dust. The dry coating provides a low coefficient of friction which gives excellent lubrication and release properties. Super Lube® DRI-FILM can be used on wood, paper, glass, rubber, fabric, leather, vinyl, metal and most plastics not under stress. It has excellent thermal and chemical stability, forming a natural insulating barrier when used on electronics.
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Dry (Teflon) lube - Provides a dry and tackless, lubricant coating on almost any surface. Great for use in areas where silicon can not be used such as sign writers, panel beaters and spray painters.

Blaster's The Dry (Teflon lubricant) Lube utilizes the benefits of a dry lubricant (PTFE) to provide a dry, tackless, chalky white lubricant coating on almost any surface. Blaster's The Dry Lube will provide long-lasting lubrication to any mechanical component. It excels where sliding surface require less friction (i.e. sliding wood across a table saw's surface) The Dry Lube's excellent anti-stick properties make this a suitable release agent in may applications..

All Good Medicine,
Crow

banner

Good post Crow, Noted and thanks.

Crow Horse

Geez, I forgot to mention 2 other "wet" lubricants I use that might prove themselves lubricating climbing gear. Militec 1 and Break Free are 2 lubricants I use on my weapons that I'm really pleased with. They might be worth trying as well........

treeshaveneeds

I climb with aluminum screwgate biners, that show red if coming undone. Almost never use biners for rigging, prob because I mostly use 3/4" nylon lay for lowering.

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Eric Frei

What are you lowering? Cars? what is the breaking strength of that? A_Lopa uses large 3 strand too, about 1.25" for big gums.

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