Types of Biners you use.

Therrin · 11th April 2008, 10:23 PM

Aerial,

The wire-core flip you posted is somewhat near and dear as it was the first wire-core flip I ever bought. Works very nicely, especially if you've never used one before.

I hate leaving the bitter end dangling way below my feet, I loop the extra on my left side through a large accessory biner, and clip that to my saddle. Typically if I'm workin something that's only 12-36" dia then I don't need most of it, but occasionally I find that I could use some extra and I just unclip a loop from the biner on my side. I've found that it keeps the tail out of my way.

Word of warning however, I keep the spare loops coiled BIG, only 2 or 3 of them hanging there. It being wire-core, if you continually coil it in any fashion it will stress the wire and could lead to a wire-core breakage. Don't kink the lanyard at all and keep it in nice loops if you can't hang it straight.

Beware the false-sense of courage you can get from using wire-cored lanyards!

newguy18 · 11th April 2008, 10:26 PM

I jsut spliced my self a nice large 3 strand lanyard.Its about 45' long and i splicd 2 prussics for it.I use a vt for the adjustment.It is definatly easier to work up around the trunks of big oaks and can be used as a short climb line for short traverses.

Therrin · 11th April 2008, 10:29 PM

A 45' lanyard???

whiskey tango foxtrot, over

So uh... what kinda BINERS have ya got on that wicked lanyard NG?

Pics?

newguy18 · 11th April 2008, 10:32 PM

I'll post pics tommorow,i gotta get more batteries for my camera.I use a quick link on the v.t and my screw lock biner on the eye end.It flips very easily.I made it for when i get out there for my redwood climb with Jerry but decided to use it on a few jobs.

Therrin · 11th April 2008, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

I'll post pics tommorow,i gotta get more batteries for my camera.I use a quick link on the v.t and my screw lock biner on the eye end.It flips very easily.I made it for when i get out there for my redwood climb with Jerry but decided to use it on a few jobs.

HELLFIRE AND BRIMSTONE SHALL RAIN DOWN UPON THEE!!!!

How is it that you can give me so much shit when I post a picture of my lanyards with screw-lock biners on them, and then you go and say that you're still using them? Grrrrr.....

Aerial · 12th April 2008, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguy18

Your climb line is your life line.What i listed is the absolute nesscities for a begining climber.Nothing more.

My mistake for not understanding the obvious. I'd didn't understand the relationship between lifeline and climb line.

My approach to learning this is to have myself on belay by a trusted ground man with a "lifeline" attached to my full fall harness, with the D ring between my shoulder blades.

I'll use another rope as my "climb line" and practice self belay techniques with that. You have to remember that I'm a total rookie with tree gear and am not up to speed about even the proper terminology, much less it's proper use. I have a lot to learn.

Aerial

Aerial · 12th April 2008, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Aerial,

The wire-core flip you posted is somewhat near and dear as it was the first wire-core flip I ever bought. Works very nicely, especially if you've never used one before... I hate leaving the bitter end dangling.. I loop the extra on my left side through a large accessory biner... I've found that it keeps the tail out of my way... Word of warning ... Don't kink the lanyard at all and keep it in nice loops if you can't hang it straight...!

I worried about that dangling end, so I only got a 10' line. I also decided to go with the 5/8 line with double eyelets on it:

They didn't offer a 45' version

Aerial

Therrin · 12th April 2008, 06:42 AM

If you choose to do it that way, I'd suggest that you attatch your belay line somewhere in front of you.
It gives you more control should a situation arise that you need to manage it.

I was belayed into the tree my first time pruning pines when I worked for the conference center about 6 years ago. It's a good backup system for initial ascents. As I progressed I'd lanyard and biner different limbs to clip into. Wasn't entirely too different from a crag climb, technologically speaking.

I think that flip I got was 12' or 14' The extra footage came in handy from time to time.

newguy18 · 12th April 2008, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

HELLFIRE AND BRIMSTONE SHALL RAIN DOWN UPON THEE!!!!

How is it that you can give me so much shit when I post a picture of my lanyards with screw-lock biners on them, and then you go and say that you're still using them? Grrrrr.....

I never gave you hell about it,that was danny and q.

Aerial · 12th April 2008, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

If you choose to do it that way, I'd suggest that you attatch your belay line somewhere in front of you... It gives you more control...

Yes for fall protection I'll be hooked in at the rear, but for climbing and belaying I want the attachment point in front like traditional rock climbers. Again this is my own pants and suspenders method for recreational tree climbing.

I have a climbing belt that incorporates a seat and a second pair of D rings on straps. Are these used to attach climbing lines and belaying equipment, while the set of D rings at the side are used for the flipline?

Here's a photo of what I bought:

Aerial

newguy18 · 12th April 2008, 09:32 AM

yes the front rings that are part of the seat are for a climb line or belay line.Its good to be belayed by another guy until you get the hang of it but a properly tied tautline hitch will hold you and it won't slip or let you fall unless its cut or isn't tied right.I also recomend useing one biner for both your climb line and belay line so that the rings are together,just to help prevent slip through.

newguy18 · 13th April 2008, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

A 45' lanyard???

whiskey tango foxtrot, over

So uh... what kinda BINERS have ya got on that wicked lanyard NG?

Pics?

heres some pics of all my gear except for my spurs.
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/g...IMG_0020-1.jpg
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/g...7/IMG_0024.jpg
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/g...IMG_0025-1.jpg

Therrin · 13th April 2008, 10:23 PM

Aerial,

My suggestion of attatching your "fall protection attatchment point" in the front as opposed to the rear wasn't mentioned offhand.

Although I'm relatively new to the tree industry (less than 5 years), I've 10 years experience as a rescue trained high ropes course and rock climbing instructor. I've belayed thousands of people using that method.

Take a moment to listen, please, and assess what I'm saying before deciding that you'll just do it how you've already decided to do it.

Personally I'm not fond of the saddle ya got.... but it's personal preference. I like the floating D in the middle because it lends me more versatility. However, you could still attatch in the front either clipping into those D's with a seperate biner, or put a "floating" loop between them and biner into that.

What happens when you fall off a branch, get hung up and your line is tangled, but its attatched at your BACK where you can't easily reach it? What happens when something unforseeable to you *now* happens, and then you're unable to effectively overcome it?
Always give yourself the opportunity for more control. I think those rear-attatchment points were meant for fall arrest in other types of workplaces, not in situations where you can get potentially hung up with noone around to help you.

I worked for a short period of time, years ago in the RiteAid warehouse out here. The forklift crews all wore full body harnesses, with the attatchment in the back, based on the theory that if they fell, they'd be held secure UNTILL SOMEONE ELSE COULD GET TO THEM with another forklift or similar.
You don't have that luxury while working with trees, and based on the areas you might end up climbing, firetrucks and such may not have easy access. There might not be people for long ways around who can perform rescues.

Give yourself the small chance to control your climbing situation by being able to access your attatchments when being belayed in a tree.

Mmmm, that having been said... I'd rather hang for hours in a seat-type harness than one attatched in such a way as to put pressure on my chest while I'm hanging. Think about it.

Aerial · 14th April 2008, 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Aerial,

My suggestion of attatching your "fall protection attatchment point" in the front as opposed to the rear wasn't mentioned offhand... Take a moment to listen, please, and assess what I'm saying ... Personally I'm not fond of the saddle ya got.... but it's personal preference... Give yourself the small chance to control your climbing situation by being able to access your attatchments when being belayed in a tree... Think about it.

All good points Therrin, and well taken. The harness I pictured above has the two forward D rings that can be coupled together with a 'biner" and used as a forward attachment point.

I also have a climbing saddle that I have been working on adding to my traditional Miller climbing belt (which I prefer) so that I can have a forward attachment point for my climb line, as well as leg straps to distribute my suspended weight.

Aerial

Aerial · 14th April 2008, 01:31 AM

Here is a photo of the belt and harness together:

Besides the simple climbing saddle addition to my Miller belt, I have ordered this for rappelling and possible tree use

Aerial

View Poll Results: What types of carabiners do you use for climbing and rigging, you are allowed 2 votes
Climb with auto locking biner	62	74.70%
Climb with screw gate biner	8	9.64%
Climb with either, doesn't matter to me	13	15.66%
Rig with auto locking biner	16	19.28%
Rig with screw gate biner	25	30.12%
Rig with either, doesn't matter to me	26	31.33%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 83. You may not vote on this poll

11th April 2008, 10:23 PM	#151 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,270	Re: Types of Biners you use. Aerial, The wire-core flip you posted is somewhat near and dear as it was the first wire-core flip I ever bought. Works very nicely, especially if you've never used one before. I hate leaving the bitter end dangling way below my feet, I loop the extra on my left side through a large accessory biner, and clip that to my saddle. Typically if I'm workin something that's only 12-36" dia then I don't need most of it, but occasionally I find that I could use some extra and I just unclip a loop from the biner on my side. I've found that it keeps the tail out of my way. Word of warning however, I keep the spare loops coiled BIG, only 2 or 3 of them hanging there. It being wire-core, if you continually coil it in any fashion it will stress the wire and could lead to a wire-core breakage. Don't kink the lanyard at all and keep it in nice loops if you can't hang it straight. Beware the false-sense of courage you can get from using wire-cored lanyards! __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

11th April 2008, 10:26 PM	#152 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,646	Re: Types of Biners you use. I jsut spliced my self a nice large 3 strand lanyard.Its about 45' long and i splicd 2 prussics for it.I use a vt for the adjustment.It is definatly easier to work up around the trunks of big oaks and can be used as a short climb line for short traverses. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

11th April 2008, 10:29 PM	#153 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,270	Re: Types of Biners you use. A 45' lanyard??? whiskey tango foxtrot, over So uh... what kinda BINERS have ya got on that wicked lanyard NG? Pics? __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

11th April 2008, 10:32 PM	#154 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,646	Re: Types of Biners you use. I'll post pics tommorow,i gotta get more batteries for my camera.I use a quick link on the v.t and my screw lock biner on the eye end.It flips very easily.I made it for when i get out there for my redwood climb with Jerry but decided to use it on a few jobs. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

12th April 2008, 06:42 AM	#158 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,270	Re: Types of Biners you use. If you choose to do it that way, I'd suggest that you attatch your belay line somewhere in front of you. It gives you more control should a situation arise that you need to manage it. I was belayed into the tree my first time pruning pines when I worked for the conference center about 6 years ago. It's a good backup system for initial ascents. As I progressed I'd lanyard and biner different limbs to clip into. Wasn't entirely too different from a crag climb, technologically speaking. I think that flip I got was 12' or 14' The extra footage came in handy from time to time. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

12th April 2008, 09:32 AM	#161 (permalink)
newguy18 Part of the Furniture Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Live Oak Florida home of the crapiest trees you will ever see. Posts: 2,646	Re: Types of Biners you use. yes the front rings that are part of the seat are for a climb line or belay line.Its good to be belayed by another guy until you get the hang of it but a properly tied tautline hitch will hold you and it won't slip or let you fall unless its cut or isn't tied right.I also recomend useing one biner for both your climb line and belay line so that the rings are together,just to help prevent slip through. __________________ Have your say join us today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkd_m4ivmc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzfzb...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-OqK...eature=related

13th April 2008, 10:23 PM	#163 (permalink)
Therrin The Tree World Bandit Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lancaster, Ca Posts: 1,270	Re: Types of Biners you use. Aerial, My suggestion of attatching your "fall protection attatchment point" in the front as opposed to the rear wasn't mentioned offhand. Although I'm relatively new to the tree industry (less than 5 years), I've 10 years experience as a rescue trained high ropes course and rock climbing instructor. I've belayed thousands of people using that method. Take a moment to listen, please, and assess what I'm saying before deciding that you'll just do it how you've already decided to do it. Personally I'm not fond of the saddle ya got.... but it's personal preference. I like the floating D in the middle because it lends me more versatility. However, you could still attatch in the front either clipping into those D's with a seperate biner, or put a "floating" loop between them and biner into that. What happens when you fall off a branch, get hung up and your line is tangled, but its attatched at your BACK where you can't easily reach it? What happens when something unforseeable to you now happens, and then you're unable to effectively overcome it? Always give yourself the opportunity for more control. I think those rear-attatchment points were meant for fall arrest in other types of workplaces, not in situations where you can get potentially hung up with noone around to help you. I worked for a short period of time, years ago in the RiteAid warehouse out here. The forklift crews all wore full body harnesses, with the attatchment in the back, based on the theory that if they fell, they'd be held secure UNTILL SOMEONE ELSE COULD GET TO THEM with another forklift or similar. You don't have that luxury while working with trees, and based on the areas you might end up climbing, firetrucks and such may not have easy access. There might not be people for long ways around who can perform rescues. Give yourself the small chance to control your climbing situation by being able to access your attatchments when being belayed in a tree. Mmmm, that having been said... I'd rather hang for hours in a seat-type harness than one attatched in such a way as to put pressure on my chest while I'm hanging. Think about it. __________________ Ken Fessia I.T.S.A. Tree Service (661) 916-4703

14th April 2008, 01:31 AM	#165 (permalink)
Aerial Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 230	Re: Types of Biners you use. Here is a photo of the belt and harness together: Besides the simple climbing saddle addition to my Miller belt, I have ordered this for rappelling and possible tree use Aerial