SRT Rig

Therrin

I thought there was another thread for this stuff but couldn't find it.

This is my SRT rig. It consists of a Petzl Minitraxion which I attatch to my harness's sliding D, and a Petzl Tibloc which is connected to a screw-locking biner and footloop.

Once you're standing next to the line and clipped in, you just put your foot in the loop and "stand up", the rope slides through the minitraxion to the extent of your push, then you "sit down" and grab the rope underneat the Tibloc, and slide it up the rope till it hits the bottom of the minitraxion and then you "stand up" again. Fairly simple rig, I can ascend 150 feet in about 4 or 5 mins, without much effort. It's just sitting down and standing up, you don't need to hold your own weight or strain at all.

To descend using this system, I pull a bight of rope up between the two, loop it through a 'figure 8 descender'. Clipping the footloop above or below the minitraxion allows me to add or subtract the components from the system.

I've been using this for a while now, it's comfy and I'm quick with it. The minitraxion has a sliding cheek, so you can add it anywhere, and the Tibloc just slips onto the rope.

Therrin

Forgot to mention,

I get the line in the tree, then either tie a running bowline around the base of the trunk, or tie a running bowline around the line itself and pull it up till its cinched. Using these techniques keeps from excessive rubbing on the leader with my full weight on it.

quercus

fairly good set-up therrin. I like the mini -and pro-traxion and have them myself, but I hate those tiblocs because they can severely damage rope.

why don't you attach a pulley as a false crotch device along with a double line on the end of your SRT line and pull it into the crown and then tie it off to the base? saves you time and effort. Yeaah it's a bit slower, but it kinda narrows the friction down due to the pulley. You can start workign immediately without having to go to the top first to install the 2:1 system.

newguy18

the only srt i have ever done was footlocking.it isn't practical here as drt is fairly quick.

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Pro Nemus

I climb SRT fairly often, to save both time and energy. Also, as I will switch to a split-tail system once I reach a suitable TIP, it is nice to have the SRT line there just in case somebody has to come up after me.

Also, with all respect, I do have a suggestion about your rig:

First off, I run a slightly different system. I use a Knut hitch with a micropulley to tend. I also use a Pantin, and a Petzl handled ascender with a tether and foot loop. Together, the system is quick, and takes very little effort.

My point, though, has to do with the tether. To me it is important to have the handled ascender tethered to my saddle, so that if my hitch were to unexpectedly fail I am still secured to the line. I am not familiar with the Tibloc, but I would imagine that you could tether it as an added measure of safety.

Call me overly cautious if you'd like; I believe that, in safety, 2 is 1 and 1 is 0.

Therrin

Yeah I agree with ya. Wouldn't be any trouble to through a loop between the tibloc's biner and my harness. Good point.

Quercus, I've been using the tiblocs for several years now. Used simple prussik's before that. If you use the propper rope diameter, the tibloc's really don't damage the rope any more than say, the minitraxion itself, or their "basic" model would. On rope that is too thin or too thick though, it can rough up the outter surface, especially on stuff that's too thin... it tends to slip through and the teeth work it over.

On normal 7/16" line though they work beautifully. I like em cuz they're quick, lightweight, and I can slap one on one-handed.

arborjockey

About a week ago we got a gm that is about 220lbs. so Ive been using a single, static line with a 4 inch pulley attached. Then pull up my double rope (thats in the pulley). Next I pull the lines up to the crotch and tie the static to the base.Then I put a pulley around the base of the tree where my tail gos through. Then he pulls on that and I can pull myself hand over hand.

quercus

we do that a lot, arb... but we use the GRCS and a gas-powered drill for that.

Tree Machine

The more complicated you can make it, the better. That seems to be the trend. I'll explore that.

George Hayduke

Tiblocs make good bottle openers and key fobs...that's all, oh, they also work really good at trashing rope sheaths.

Did you read the instruction sheet for the Tibloc? It is supposed to only be used with certain rope configurations, carabiner diameters and cross sections.

MT instructions

http://tinyurl.com/26wccr

Therrin

George, I believe I mentioned that, had you read it?

Why you gotta bash on my method? lol, you didn't even mention what yours *is*. I actually use the propper diameter and type of rope for my tiblocs, if you're trashing rope sheaths with them, then you obviously failed to use them properly the first time around.

Maybe a little more research is in order?

Tree Machine

Also, Tiblocs tear up rope if impacted. It takes force to shred rope, if you don't subject a Tibloc to moderate or violent force, you will not shred rope; two examples:

I use a Tibloc on SRT above my handled ascender to back it up. The single-handled ascender has as yet never failed, so the Tibloc, even though it has been used for years, has never come close to shredding a rope.

Therrin uses the Tibloc above a foot stirrup. It will take his full weight each and every time he stands up on it. If Therrin were shredding ropes, this experienced Arborist would not be using a Tibloc.

MTS247

I think the method quercus mentioned is great, as you can work straight away, and also you can build a safety feature into the system, by attaching the single line to the tree with a grigri, alowing the ground crew to lower you out of the tree at any time.

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Therrin

I'm not sure how well that would actually work.

Most of the handled cams, like a grigri, still need the rope to be slightly unweighted before the cam can un-jam and start feeding again. In such case you would need to pull the line down that side enough to unweight the mechanism.

Then again, maybe something like a prussik or tibloc attatched to a footloop would give enough budge to unweight the grigri and allow it to feed.

Q, how do the grigri's perform in this setting?

TREEMONKEY

If i was to use this system i would not use a gri gri better chance it could get damaged ( i think). i would use a tandem prusik minding pulley one longer prussik and a short one.this way it can take a little abuse (accidents happen)and you are not relying on one mechanical devise. the pulley is their so you can raise the person if you have to and unjam the prusik if required.

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MTS247

I may not have explained it properly,

1st Shoot thowline high in tree, it dosnt mater where the line comes down as long as the high point is safe, pull rope through.

2nd Attach pully to end of rope, place lifeline "DRT" through pully then pull up tree, thus creating frictionless attachment point.

3rd Attach end of first rope to base of tree using "safe" knot. so the system is set up so that if the first rope is undone and "lowered" the climber can be lowered at anytime. its even easyer to lower climber/tension rope if a grigri or prussic is used.

I would not normaly use this for removals as i just adds extra lines in the tree, and the system could get damaged.

This system works well for me on cypress, cedar, pines, because i can shoot the line over a high point and not need to get the line back down the way it went up, you can just brind it down and not worry about where it goes.

Im not saying i use it all the time, but its just another one of those things that i use to make climbing easyer for me. some wont like climbing on the pully as it takes time to get used to no friction.
you can also get a groundy to "pull" you up the tree

What things do "you" like to use to make climbing easyer.

Therrin

A full dinner the night before, lots of sleep, a light breakfast, a clear head, and a fully loaded Arb Harpoon

Fairfield

Have any of you guys tried doing a SRT with a GRIGRI and having your DRT attache to that? This way it is easy getting up to a good point and also easy to work.

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Grizzly

I need to try that some time. It seems too easy, but the way I have had more sucess with, especially in lagre tree such as african pines is to go up with 2 climbing line and lock tie to the top. It gets exhausting after a while but once you get to the top, the stress of getting up there and wobbling on weak limbs is gone and after tieing off its back to basic pruning from there. Its a total cake walk from there once I fired up the saw. Music to my ears.

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George Hayduke

A whole lot of SRT variations...all of them have two independent attachment points. RADS or Tree Frog or Texas or hybrid combinations.

Using a trunk wrap belay is much safer than choking the climbing line to the upper limb or around the trunk. Why not build in a simple rescue belay system?

Fairfield

I think having the belay system at the ground is great without a doubt. The time I can see an issue with it and I think guys around my parts would run into it, is when the climber is going to have to be lowerd past many other branches. At that point you have to send another climber up to in the very least just guide the vic down. Like I said though I really like the belay system at the ground just wach the falling limbs and crazy groundies with saws around it

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Oldtimer

Quote" This is my SRT rig. It consists of a Petzl Minitraxion which I attach to my harness's sliding D, and a PETZL Tibloc which is connected to a screw-locking biner and footloop." End of Quote

I was reading the specs for the Minitraxion and it says that the Max Capacity of the load on the pulley should be 5kN ( 2.5 kN on each side while lifting a load - The climber in this case).

My question: Does this meet the safety capacity requirements (ISA/ANSI) that the climbing gear (ropes and attachments) should meet 23kN or around 5000 lbs? Also, Doesn't the climber has to be attached at two points (back ups) on the climbing line?

Please understand that I am not critiquing anybodies climbing gear only that I want to learn from the people that uses this stuff on a daily basis at their jobs.

George Hayduke

There is no ANSI standard for tree workers that requires two attachment points. This is a recommendation that makes sense for ascent at a minimum though.

Can you post a link tothe MT spec sheet? That would be an interesting thing to look at.

Therrin

Since having posted this thread I've added a loop between the Tibloc biner and my harness. Just a little backup there.

When I use it for SRT, I'm not really using the pulley part at all, it's kind of in a "passive" mode.
Also, since it's always clipped directly into my harness (usually the sliding D), and the line isn't given much slack, there's relatively no shock loading occuring with it, just smooth operation for ascent.


You're right about the kn ratings though, I just looked it up, they are pretty low.

quercus

On the other hand there's virtually no way you're gonna get a load of 5 kn's when you statically load it when doing an SRT ascent. I've seen them being used by riggers too as a means of fall arrest. They trail the rope very nicely on the way up, so there's actually no big loading factor when sliding or falling down again. Petzl approved this pulley for an SRT ascent though.

George Hayduke

That may be so```but I wonder if this configuration would satisfy US OSHA/ANSI regs?