Saddles

Gunslinger

Recently I tried EKKA's method, spikeless DRT access with trunk walking outlined here:

http://www.treeworld.info/f7/spikele...k-etc-897.html

First thing that I noticed was the incredible strain this placed on the lower back. My guess is that the Weaver 4-D basic saddle that I'm using doesn't provide enough lower back support with it's flimsy cloth belt. After doing so research I've discovered, (what most of you already know), that there are many choices in saddles.

When purchasing a new saddle I can see that back support is essential, a wide padded back is needed to provide long climb comfort.
So what others options are important? Leaving out cost, which of the following choices is are best when choosing a saddle:

Butt strap or leg loops?

Floating D, fixed D or no D?

One D or Two?

Tongue buckles or quick-connect buckles?

Is saddle weight really a factor?

I know that there isn't a one size fits all answer. I'm just trying to gather some opinions from the guys who use these things everyday.

newguy18

I got a petzl navaho sit,i still have my weaver 4 d.The butt strap is better if you spend long hours hanging around,I perfer leg loops as theres really no excuse to be hanging around cause time is money.Back support is really essential,i had to buy another saddle because the weaver put alot of presure on my sciatic nerve and having pinched it twice and the last time i couldn't walk for 3 hours afterwards i decided its probabley a good idea to buy a better saddle so i don't pinch it while aloft.I love my petzl,no regrets.

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Eric Frei

This is tough and personal ... also depends on the work you do.

You need to perhaps try a few out, there's some hi-tech ones out like treemotion etc.

I like mine, dread getting a new one coz it fits like a glove. But then again, I could be denying myself a better one. Decent back support is a must, especially for heavier chainsaws.

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OutofMytree

Hey Gun. Like Ekka said this is a personal choice. Perhaps you could list the standard gear you take into a tree and the most extreme gear you take up there. It would also be useful to know how many hours per day and days per week you climb on average.

That said, I climb on and recommend, the Buckingham Traverse. Dunno if it is called the same name in the US but it has 2 floating D's for your lifeline, 2 pairs of fixed D's for fliplines, 4 gear rings, padded back support and a padded seat with rigid support.

I climb all sort of things from Cocos Palms to 30 metre Eucs and have found this saddle a great all rounder. I don't pay much attention to weight so this may be heavier than you wish....on the other hand, in the words of the modern sage Mark "Chopper" Reed, HARDEN THE F*&K UP!!

Gunslinger

Thanks for the responses. I've read some opinions where guys have said they disliked the leg loops for long times aloft. But even if you spend hours at a time in the canopy are you really hanging in the saddle? I kind of like the rigid batten butt strap idea because I've noticed that the saddle can kind of pinch the legs together when suspended. Is there any real disadvantage to using one of them? I'm seem to remember EKKA using that type of butt strap in his videos. Looked like a Buckingham saddle if I recall correctly.

Do floating D's really make a difference when limb walking? This would seem to be a benefit because it allows the attachment point to slide to the side.

Garry Brockley

I use leg loops because they are less restrictive for the way i climb, i find the seat holds my knees together too much; the best you can do is try both types and see what suits you but floating d's or like my butterfly no d rings just a front lanyard that your biner attaches to are essential imho. they give you the ability to manouvre to either side easily and stay there without too much effort.like outofmytree says tell us what you climb with we may be able to give you some pointers

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OutofMytree

I'm with Galbee on the floating D's for your lifeline. Whatever the system the attachment to your harness needs to have lateral movement and yes, you are correct Gun, it is for branchwalking.

Gunslinger

Ok, my basic climbing has been for recreation but as of late it has been to remove some dead limbs and to do some minor pruning of the Northern Pin Oaks around my house. Here's my story:

My interest in climbing has been around since I was a kid, you know monkey climbing/tree house stuff. When I worked for a landscaping company during college we did small tree pruning/removals. That usually involved not much more than an extension ladder, a rope and a pole climbers positioning belt with a rope lanyard. We usually went up the ladder, entered the canopy and climbed the limbs. On one occasion I was atop the ladder and removing a limb with a handsaw. Holding another limb with my left hand and cutting with my right. The saw bound up (was dull as crap) and when I applied extra force on the back stroke to pull it out my left hand slipped and I fell backwards off the ladder onto some concrete. Although I broke no bones that was the last time that I actually climbed without any safety equipment.

So now I've been climbing some 80' oaks and just trying to learn the proper methods that the pros' use. For that, this forum has been a great resource. Not only for what to do but what not to do. I've been using split-tail system w/ trunk walking/body thrusting when I'm close to the trunk. When away from the trunk I've been using the secured footlock method. I've found recently as I spend more time climbing that my basic saddle is somewhat uncomfortable so I've been looking for opinions as to the best type of saddle to use. I realize that there is no one right answer but I'm sure that everyone has an opinion as to what fits them best and why. That's the feedback that I'm trying to ascertain.

newguy18

Heres what i got.

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Gunslinger

From what I've seen, I like the Petzls. Are they really geared for arborists or more for recreational climbers?

newguy18

They're designed for arborists but can be used for sport.I got that one for 105.00 bucks but it was used once.

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Garry Brockley

I think Body type plays abig part in the choice you make im 6'2" and have climbed on one of these for 10 years its shelf life ran out this year so i bought a french version which is lighter and even more comfortable.

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TrevMcRev

Hey Galbee, any more feedback on the butterfly2 would be great. I can get these but arent stocking them yet as i'm personally not familiar with them.

I like to only sell stuff i know myself or have solid advice from experience on.

gids

Has anybody used the Kookaburra Harness ?

I don't climb day in day out. Generally 1-2 days a week.

I'm not that big either 165cm/60kg's.

Any other suggestions ?

Thanks,
Andrew

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OutofMytree

Couple of things I notice about the harness pictured here.

First there are only one set of D rings for attaching your lanyard. I really like having two. It means when using two lanyards they don't tangle as easily and its MUCH harder to unclip the wrong one. It is also, occasionally, useful to have a second D because it puts a slight twist on your hips so you can counter the sideways pull you get when spurring trees with a noticable lean.

Second I don't see how the life line D can "float". Not only does that make branch walking more awkward but it also means that on the odd occasions when you use two lifelines you don't get the same strain relief on your lower back. The pivot point is still in front of your hips which means your lower back must stay tense to hold you still. This really means a lot at the end of a long day.

I have never climbed on anything but my Traverse so I am not in a position to compare loops to seats. Those people I know who have used both say that loops are better for short climbs and saddle for long climbs escpecially if you are working in one position for any period of time.

willem

This my saddle. Good back support, floating D, a of adjusment possibilities and legloops with iron plates. The legloops are lose but give a lot of support when hanging in the saddle with you full bodyweight.

OutofMytree

Looks interesting Willem. Could you post either a bigger photo or perhaps a link to a website with a bigger photo? I am keen to see the close up details..

willem

This is a link to english webpage that sells the saddle and even has comments.
Tree Climbers International - EKN Kolibri Multislide

FlashD

personally, i use a back jack. it has a ton of back support, and is extremely affordable. the one that i have has quick connect leg straps and two floating dees. it's a little heavy when doing anything on the ground, but once i'm suspended i don't notice it anymore. it's an older style saddle, but works great in modern times if you ask me.
oh, and i climb both for recreation and for work.

RC1

Delighted with mine Willem....a true working saddle in every sense

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osb_mail

listen to newguy brag about the saddle that he almost stole ( for price and condition it is in ) from me . I am so glad you are getting a lot use out of it , I just could not get comfortable in it .I will stick with my old 4dee weaver with leg straps .

newguy18

lol,you named the price,man even with a back pad my weaver put alot of ressure on my sciatic nerve,none from the petzl.Its doing great for me,its not bad at all for long days in spurs and a flipline.

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osb_mail

not sure what a sciatic nerve is probably dont want to find out sounds painful

newguy18

Its a big nerve in your lower back,believe me if you pinch it you will know it.

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