Disussion on tree pull technique

MTS247

I’ve seen a few people now suggesting you will get more pull from diagram 1.
I think they are getting confused with the 2:1 sort of action you get with diagram 2.

I just don’t see how it could increase the pull power as all the rope parts are static.

I’m not suggesting it’s a bad idea, just that you don’t get any more “pull” by doing it.

Anyone else seen this?

Attached Thumbnails

   

__________________
"Just cause i don't use it, don't make it wrong!"

Eric Frei

You have two totally different MA's here.

#1 is static, and same if you tied at the top of the tree versus over the top then down at the trunk (as pictured).

#2 will have some movement. That branch you are going over the rope will move over it as the anchored end of the rope is not on the same tree. In effect that branch is acting like a really poorly turning pulley (lots of friction) or like natural crotch rigging, you will get some MA out of it.

Think about it, if that branch in pic 1 was a pulley tied up there, there would be no difference when you pull on the tree to fell it. But in pic 2 if that were a pulley up there you'd get 2:1 MA

__________________

MTS247

So you agree, that in pic1 there is no advantage in attaching the rope at the bottom by the scaff.

Pic2 was just an example of a rough 2:1 (ish), of course it would work better with a pully or a block.

We finally agree on somthing

__________________
"Just cause i don't use it, don't make it wrong!"

Eric Frei

My comments in green, coz they are positive.

__________________

dannyboysfc

Hmm. I never thought of doing it like in pic 2. Your pulley or block might get kinda messed up I would think. I usually set it up like pic 1 just use a couple of pulleys and rig the MA with the same rope to an anchor like a different tree.

Treebeard

Seems like only 1 leg is doing the work in #1
and 2 legs doing the work in #2
IMO

Eric Frei

Yes, you are absolutely correct. There is MA (mechanical advantage) in #2

__________________

Willard Holmen

I use this mechanical advantage alot now because I work alone. I can keep tension with my Maasdam rope puller on a risky side leaner with poor hinge wood etc. and still be at the felling cut area controlling the wedges, cut, etc.
Easier to keep an eye on the hinge also as the tree is going down to avoid barber chairing for example.
Willard.

Attached Thumbnails

 

Treebeard

Are you using the 3 strand rope with that puller? I am about to have to buy some replacement rope since I nicked the old Bluestreak rope I was using with my masdam puller and was curious what other people were using with theirs.

BTW Just a thought: if you could find a tree behind the one being felled to hook your puller to, you wouldn't risk crushing the puller when the tree fell and still be in the vicinity of your cut. I'm sure you know this, but wanted to point that out for others.

rbtree

You all are forgetting that when the rope is terminated at the tree's base, there is also a multiplication of the pull force. Think of it like a speed line being tightened. The closer the rope angle gets to 180 degrees, the force quickly increases at the anchor ends, relative to the load, and not in a linear fashion, but exponentially to a degree. A somewhat similar effect occurs in this application.

Willard Holmen

Never had a problem crushing the puller, as soon as the tree starts to fall there is more then enough slack to quickly pull the puller to the side out of harms way.
Yes I do use 1/2" 3 strand with the Maasdam puller. I got a bag with 300 feet and it just takes a few seconds to feed it into the puller. Its not as nice to work with as the bag of 1/2" stable braid but the 3 strand doesn't slip in the ratchet and is as tough as nails.
Willard.

Treebeard

Thx for the info Willard. I guess I'm going with the 3 strand then.
On your attachment point at the top of the tree do you use a simple running bowline or spliced eye choked with a carabiner? Or something else?

Willard Holmen

I use a running bowline.Rope placed with a throwline, shot up by my Big Shot [slingshot]. On a limbless spar the tree was climbed anyways so the rope would be tied up there.
If a bowline can't be made because of interference from limbs, then I tie the rope down just above the cut at the stump. I use a whoopie sling at the base below the cut to attach the puller to.
Willard.

prestigetrees

they both work but why dont you just put the truck on it and not give it a choice but to go where you want it to,
if you cant get access with a truck then just put a turfer winch on it,either way you rig the rope it wont matter because you can put 4.5 tonne of pull on the trunk,

second-gen_monkey

i think the idea is based on being in an are unaccessable by a vehicle. or somewhere you don't want to tear up the turf. or maybe if you want to be able to accurately guage the tension on the tree so you dont pull it over halfway through the cut before you are ready for it.

prestigetrees

thats why i suggested a turfer winch so you can pull the tree/trunk over without the damage to the turf or surroundings,they sell for like $300 from any 4x4 shop,

dumppicker

Thank you, Holman Tree; I had an old dead ash leaning right over my camp woodshed that was giving me fits trying to figure out how to take it down safely. When I saw your technique, I knew that would work. The old tree came down right where I planned. The family was there, and it made me look like I actually knew what I was doing. Thanks again!