Convince me to switch to srt.

newguy18

So far i've come up with an old school srt method,thanks to the fundamentals of general treework,when i can i'll be picking up 2 gibbs ascenders.Convince of other methods,perfeably with little to no equipment,i don't need 3 ascenders and a back up for each or something that has lots of gizmos,just something simple like the tech i read about to get my silly butt into tall trees.
I'm not too worried about descenders as i have that srt knot i made,i trust it.

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rbtree

SRT isn't and can't be bare bones.

I have a Foot ascender, sweet for footlocking the tail in normal DdRT. or for SRT, combine with a chest harness to hold a Croll, and a second ascender for the other foot, which can be on a loop. This method is called ropewalking, and is fast and effortless.

The Texas, or Frog method is simpler. Two ascenders. one or two footloops,both or one attached to one ascender. a second ascender to capture progress. Handle needed on the upper ascender. The lower can be made to self advance with the addition of a bungee between the two. A prussic backup is required for safety, so it's pretty gear intensive.

I also have a set of bars made by Greg Liu, which are the same concept as Paul Sisson's Mar-Bars, but only require 2 CMI/Jumar ascenders instead of 4.....only for single line, Mar-Bars work on single or double lines. This method can also be very fast, but more strenuous than rope walking.

Tree Machine

Listen to rb. I can't say it any better, though I can offer a further simplified, more boiled-down / less gear manner. There is new gear out there that nail ascent / descent down to a least common-denominator.

newguy18

I'm looking for 2,but no more than 3 ascenders.I'm probabley not gonna back them all up either,so screw the prusiks,save them for footlocking and lanyards.

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TreeDimensional

Well I am officially a SRT user, or more correctly, I use the RAD (rope ascent and decent) method. The diffeance between the two is that there is no changing over of equipment to descend when using the RAD system. After an unpleasant experience of explaining the other two methods of rope work, I am shy about getting into this thread.

It appears that there is a mind-set that doesn't want to trust mechanical gizmo's. Like anything "NEW" you have to learn the limits and benefits of technology. Once I had everything setup for my physical structure, I was delighted that I had set it up. Money WELL spent.

I NOW use my whole body to climb, where before I was using way more arm/shoulder, and little leg muscle.

newguy18

Its not as much a trust issue as it is a k.i.s.s issue.

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TreeDimensional

Well I hate to be the one to tell you this NG18, but SRT IS Easier than DbRT. NO need to install a friction saver (assuming we are pruning), NO dicking around trying to isolate the working end of our climbing line..............

What COULD be simpler?

JUST SHUT UP AND TRY IT!!!!

newguy18

to many damn gizmoes to learn how to use,i don't use a friction saver. and i can tie a tautline hitch with my eyes closed.Easier on the body no doubt,but its a matter of what appeals to me,the rad and the frog are out,so is the marbar.

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Knotahippie

I use two double shoulder length slings.

Klemheist or prussic.

Klemheist is faster to tie and untie.

The thing to dial is how many wraps.

I use my safety on the lower one for redundancy.

IMO it's safe and easy.

newguy18

Saftey is not the issue,i already said,i don't plan to back every thing up,no prusiks.

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Knotahippie

No prusiks?

newguy18

nope,i don't back up my tautline so i see no point in backing up the ascenders.

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rbtree

You obviuously have no clue what you're on about.

You're also too green and inexperienced to be talking like that. Safety is all important.....backing up SRT systems has had lots of discussions among arborist that have tons and tons of experience..

Maybe, for once, you should just,.....uhhhh... read and listen...maybe go to a class. Or go to work for a seasoned vet.

Book learning and forum learning are invaluable, no doubt, but hands on is always best...and at the feet of a master would open your eyes...

rbtree

You should be shy....there's greenhorns about...


I've gotta find a source for an Edelrid Eddy......Tom Dunlap prefers it for the bottom setup for a RADS system......

He hasn't been using his RADS lately though, as his 3rd of 4th generation Unicender is working well. I'm tempted to get one, but don't like the $465 price....it is the only tool that will work on Ddrt and SRT, both up and down....

TreeDimensional

I hear you rbtree, on both accounts. We have a difficult time locating gear here as it is. I have only seen pictures of the eddie and the unicender. The cost of the unicender does seem a bit prohibitive.

About the climbing systems, quality training is a tough thing to find out here on the prairie. Makes the trip to the TCC all that more important, even though it only happens once a year. LOL, I just realized, I am a technique theif!

newguy18

Most everything i've learned thus far is hands on,this forum and jerry's fundamental book are also invaluble,i have no fear of falling,i've fallen 3 times already.I simply refuse to back up every ascender in the system,that is a waste of time and effort imo.A seasoned vet,well unless someone like Jerry beranek or Graeme mcmahon have an opening,not gonna happen.I believe i said i'm new to srt but if i didn't then i'll say it here,i'm new to srt,want a system that is simple,doesn't have to be fool proof and with no more than 3 componets.Oh btw i do alot of reading on this forum,lots of it,so maybe next time you should stfu before you get an attitude with me.

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Knotahippie

I got em, but I don't use ascenders/jumars either NG. At least in the tree. IMO, for gear, less is best.

Check it out,

I tie a prusik to the life line, clip it to my saddle. Then tie another one to the life line below it to stand in. I clip my safety to the lower one for redundancy.

Slide the top one up, sit. Slide the lower one up, stand.

Repeat. Here's how it looks on the life line.

The Prusik Knot or Triple Sliding Hitch

Eh?

newguy18

I'm quite familiar with the prusik and the klemheist both.
Can you take a pic of the setup your speaking of,i have a good idea,just wanna be sure.

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rbtree

newguy18

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Tree Machine

I'm not about to try to convince you to climb SRT, newguy. You seem to have everything figured out. Just stick with your distel. It's good enough for ya, you're comfortable on it. Why change?

Knotahippie

Super basic dude...

No pic required, not to mention I broke my camera...Doh.

letigre

im sold 100% on the efficiency of srt. i was formerly of the opinion that it was for tards and old men, but my eyes were opened at arbor camp this year. Scott Sharpe did an srt demo and a rec climb and explained all the in's and out's of it. by nature he is a very gear intensive man, however he did offer some less gear intensive solutions. i cant exactly recall the complete configuration of his system, but it seems to me the best. a croll, foot sling and pantin foot ascender were involved,but he also had some other gear in there as well.

also, im a firm believer in Access lines for tree work and i feel that an srt system is the best choice for this. another scott, (what is it with particular names and arb? chris' tim's scott's dan's) scott forrest,(no. 2 in the world none the less) has been working with us recently and has demostrated how easy and safe it is to either footlock or srt. i mean hes infuriatingly smooth and quick but he's patient teaching us and already were all giving it a go and loving it. so quick and easy. cant stress the easiness of it enough. i also want to be able to be rescued quickly as well so thats a bonus.

newguy18

I haven't climbed on distel since january,to hard to air hump with,same reason i quit using th vt and the swabisch.I gave up on the blakes,just had all that friction on that one leg and you need to make a slower descent with it.

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Gunslinger

Speaking of descent, do you use the knot for the descent of do you use a figure 8 or some other device with the knot as the backup?

newguy18

Just the knot.

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JohN Dee

Get an alloy rescue 8 man, best thing for descending. No waiting times to let the hitch cool down... Wrap up the 8, loosen the friction hitch and you can almost literally jump straight out of the tree at once....

--
Last few weeks I've also been interested in learning more SRT. Can someone put up some pics of a foot locking set up like Hili's or Jim1NZ's?

Hey TreeMachine, I remember you posting once about the correct way to use your figure of 8 and Jim1NZ said after he saw that he learned the proper way to use the 8 from your picture, could you re-post that in here if you don't mind?

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newguy18

Who waits for the hitch to cool down?Yeah i've thought about buying a figure 8.

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JohN Dee

If you don't wait for it to cool, it will burn and glaze on you, ever had melted plastic on your hand? Same thing applies here when you heat it up and it starts melting. OUCH

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TrevMcRev

What sort of prussiks are you using? Tried any of the high heat resistant cords like samson ultratech, yale beeline or new england HRC?

They still wear with heat, but much longer life than typical cord.