To TOP or Not to TOP

treevet · 3rd February 2009, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spartek

Hey Treevet , wheres most of you work and do you get out on the east side of town much?

When I first moved my bus. out here from NJ around 1980 (was out there for about 10 years) I did a lot of work in Anderson Twp. Man, long haul out 275, esp if a takedown. Almost every day I work in Wyoming, where I live and my equipment lot is right next to it in Hartwell. Maybe 1 to 2 miles travel each day.

Would way rather live out in the country like you tho. Take a piss out the back door and nobody is staring right at you. Make more money in the city IMO tho.

spartek · 3rd February 2009, 05:08 PM

Yeah , definately more $ in the city. But more appreciation in the country."Thank you kind sir for getting rid of that big oak tree, I was scared it was gonna smash my trailer". "Will $200 or $300 cover you all day labor???

treevet · 3rd February 2009, 05:16 PM

Yeah I agree way laid back in the stix. Plus you don't need to spend so much to live out there.

I am gonna crash. We're back heavy into work now if it doesn't snow more than they say it's gonna tomorrow. Later

newguy18 · 4th February 2009, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treevet

when you comin up for a visit?

Trying to put some cash back first.

treevet · 4th February 2009, 11:09 AM

Man, it is a hard time of year to do that. I am just tryin to hold on to what I saved last year.

Bob Tooley · 29th May 2009, 08:28 AM

We use to call it "Tree removal on an installment plan"...but as long as towns and cities are comfortable with the prices I guess nothing is going to change..
I wonder if they'd feel comfortable having their family doctor also working as an undertaker, because that's the flexibility built into their tree service...

Q.Q. · 16th September 2009, 11:33 PM

Hi guys, well you think that you have it tough in the cities trying to covince the public to do the right thing. Try living out here where this Topping has gone from generation to generation.

I must admitt that I am slowly getting it through to some people out here, the right way, to maintain rather than Top and Lop.

But in saying that I took these photo's a month and half ago, on a road trip, in MY AREA out here, done by the local councils from what people told me. So if you carn't get them to stop what hope do we have. This is just an hour away from me which is close.

I am putting a story in our local paper next week about things like this, and a little bit on myself as well.

Q.Q. · 16th September 2009, 11:38 PM

Yep what do you think, I forgot to tell that the local water board got a cherry picker in to paint the water tower, and hey presto lets kill some River Gums as well while where at it.

Absoloot Precission hey.

Eric Frei · 18th September 2009, 08:48 AM

Some people simply don't have their eyes connected to their brains.

Q.Q. · 19th September 2009, 12:30 AM

Better not come out here then, there's plenty of both.

old school · 19th December 2010, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therrin

Taking "top growth" off of a PINE TREE is TOPPING. Don't plant a tree with the intent of it being a bush! WTF? Plant a damn bush! I see topped pines around here all the time, they're ugly as hell, they look retarded.

So you're suggesting that taking the "top growth" from a pine, as long as you're thinking about what your doing, isn't topping?? What kind of bullshit is this? You can't go teaching your son that kind of stuff!
You're saying that topping is alright, as long as you're thinking about what you're doing, and just calling it "crown reduction" instead??? I can't beleive this!

What Arborist certification do you have that taught you this kind of practice as being okay? This is HACK WORK.

True crown reduction has a definite place. To claim otherwise shows pure ignorance.

Note: propper reduction pruning reduces size while more-or-less maintaining a trees natural form. TOPPING a pine completely slaughters it's natural form. The branches just underneath grow to a height higher than the topped section after several years, and the result is a dished-out looking top structure, looking NOTHING like a normal pine.

NEVER REDUCE A LANDSCAPE TREE BY TOPPING!

It causes decay, cracks in limbs, root decline, bark defects and other problems!

Telling your SON of all people, that what you are doing is alright merely because you're thinking about it and saying it out loud doesn't make it okay!

If someone asked me to "top those pines, because I'm using them for bushes" I'd try to explain they are TREES! not bushes! And then I'd try to educate them of what kind of harm they are intending to have done, and what the results could be instead of blindly just saying "gee, okay" and doing it.

gilman lol pesonal buddy of mine did seminors with him,he is a hudge fan or crown reduction,as i am,also know shiego ,had the plesure to work wit him,when alive,subodinate a tree to a spout or limb of the corect dia. of corse is just what you sposed to do,its by the book almost lol,the rule condensed is s.o.r.c.l- subordinate,or remove codominate leaders,idenify the leaders in the tree and shorten them,almost the same as crown reduction ,only difference your shotening your domonit central leader and as we all know it sposed to protrude beyond the co-domonits,and have no compatition,but that to can be acheived anyway when reducing,,,,,,gilman is an original floridian so thats why this practice wit huricains,shorting leaders are more resistant to wind damage,no real arborist wants to shorten a domnit central,but if it fails in a storm what do you have now ,choose another dom.central,or flush where it broke to nothing[hatrack]then selectivly prune the poorly atached spouts,,,rather or crown reduced from the get go,

old school · 19th December 2010, 12:58 AM

to its correct diam.sure[crown reduction]

old school · 19th December 2010, 02:40 AM

well im personal friends with dr. ed gilman,al shiego,george fistpatrick,the late al shiego,the leaders internationly,and the big fans of crown reduction,this is coming from guys that devote there whole lives to the arborculture world,they get hundreds of thousands of dollers of gov.grants to plant trees just to make certain diffent cuts on them to see whats the best now ten years 20 30 40 years down the line,,,,but directly from the mouth a good pruned tree is a tree thats not pruned lol,but thats for the forest we need to take in consideration residental your house,what do you want a 100+ pine over your kids bedroom,wheather your in florida where a huracain will blow the tree and snap it in half ,or the soked root system fails and falls over,or northen ice storms crack them in half,either weather condition your tree is now in your sons bed,so me ill throw on my hooks go up there and cut it as close or right on hopfully to the 1 third rule,why wait for nature to make the choice for you,cause if you do now you got a busted up house ,and still have 2 put on your hooks go up and now cut it to whatevers left, now you might be forced to hatrack lol when the right cut coud of ben preformed in the first place,and i dont no about you but i only ben doin trees my hole life now i have 2 hire a contracter to fix my house cause i cant lol

Jeff Darby · 19th December 2010, 03:06 PM

Out of curiosity how old were you when met Dr Shigo ? I would have loved to meet the late Dr Shigo !

old school · 19th December 2010, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayD

Out of curiosity how old were you when met Dr Shigo ? I would have loved to meet the late Dr Shigo !

i particapated in a seminor aborculture 3 in i think 2003,i say think cause i did it 4 years in a row and DR,Gilman was the main speaker and Shigo just made an apperence, then soon after he fell and lost his life,from what i was told by ed it was off a 6 foot ladder,not much of a talker but get a few drinks in him look out ,the aborculture secrets start spillin,,,,,,,,only kidin i no no secrets,,,,,but yes brillient man

Apocalypsse · 19th December 2010, 09:05 PM

Forgot about this thread. I'll have to get some pictures in a few weeks when I'm back up there. Mitchell Shire Council have had the Robinia's on the main street of Kilmore topped, they were nicely formed trees, no overhead powerlines to cut out parts of the tree, just prune back from buildings. Now they are ugly sticks with fluff on them. Not sure if it was council or a contractor though.

Eric Frei · 20th December 2010, 10:45 AM

Hey Old School,

What does Giman and Shigo say (or said) about spurring/spiking your prune jobs?

old school · 20th December 2010, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric Frei

Hey Old School,

What does Giman and Shigo say (or said) about spurring/spiking your prune jobs?

what any arborist would say,these guys as i am have much passion for what we do,the first time i met dr gilman i climbed a small oak only 15-18 ft. lol only cause the seminor arbor 3 there was about50 people attending a they were split into groups and givin different typs of ribbons whitch i took up wit me, each group took turns where they wud make 3 subordination cuts primarly for the health of the tree,i loved educating the people it was great,but lol it made me relize how uneducated they were,at the end of corse i got to tie my own ribbons and explain why i choose those cuts and they only wit the consent of gilman i proceed to make the cuts,but the first year i broke a water spout wit my foot by accident and he came down hard on me and said that spout was the subordination cut to make 10 years down the line so be more carful next time,now thats passion lol,few shots of jack later and now its about 8 or so years i knew him,he cool i make fun of him ,he got a bmw convertible and i say did you get a grant for the car gil lol,he got a wind machine now makes wind i think 80-100 mph. he prunes a tree liontail or some other messedup way and then subordination on a differnt one, blows the machine at them ,from what i gather the one pruned wrong co-doms break,just a mess, the one done by the book couple thinks break but the co-doms are intack dominat central leader good the things that make a tree a tree,,,anyway i cud talk all night sorry so long ,,,love the sight bro

View Poll Results: To TOP or Not to TOP
For	4	6.67%
Against	56	93.33%
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll

3rd February 2009, 05:08 PM	#92
spartek Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio, USA Posts: 151	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Yeah , definately more $ in the city. But more appreciation in the country."Thank you kind sir for getting rid of that big oak tree, I was scared it was gonna smash my trailer". "Will $200 or $300 cover you all day labor???

3rd February 2009, 05:16 PM	#93
treevet Backflipper Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA Posts: 2,131	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Yeah I agree way laid back in the stix. Plus you don't need to spend so much to live out there. I am gonna crash. We're back heavy into work now if it doesn't snow more than they say it's gonna tomorrow. Later

4th February 2009, 11:09 AM	#95
treevet Backflipper Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA Posts: 2,131	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Man, it is a hard time of year to do that. I am just tryin to hold on to what I saved last year.

29th May 2009, 08:28 AM	#96
Bob Tooley Semi-mature vigorous tree Join Date: May 2009 Location: Scarborough, Maine USA Posts: 128	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP We use to call it "Tree removal on an installment plan"...but as long as towns and cities are comfortable with the prices I guess nothing is going to change.. I wonder if they'd feel comfortable having their family doctor also working as an undertaker, because that's the flexibility built into their tree service...

16th September 2009, 11:33 PM	#97
Q.Q. Mature tree Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Western QLD. Australia Posts: 282	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Hi guys, well you think that you have it tough in the cities trying to covince the public to do the right thing. Try living out here where this Topping has gone from generation to generation. I must admitt that I am slowly getting it through to some people out here, the right way, to maintain rather than Top and Lop. But in saying that I took these photo's a month and half ago, on a road trip, in MY AREA out here, done by the local councils from what people told me. So if you carn't get them to stop what hope do we have. This is just an hour away from me which is close. I am putting a story in our local paper next week about things like this, and a little bit on myself as well. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Q,Q's Tree & Garden Maintenance FAMILARITY BREEDS CONTEMPT

16th September 2009, 11:38 PM	#98
Q.Q. Mature tree Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Western QLD. Australia Posts: 282	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Yep what do you think, I forgot to tell that the local water board got a cherry picker in to paint the water tower, and hey presto lets kill some River Gums as well while where at it. Absoloot Precission hey. __________________ Q,Q's Tree & Garden Maintenance FAMILARITY BREEDS CONTEMPT

18th September 2009, 08:48 AM	#99
Eric Frei Admin - Razor sharp and independent 2 X Diploma Level 5 qualified arborist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,792	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Some people simply don't have their eyes connected to their brains. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

19th September 2009, 12:30 AM	#100
Q.Q. Mature tree Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Western QLD. Australia Posts: 282	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Better not come out here then, there's plenty of both. __________________ Q,Q's Tree & Garden Maintenance FAMILARITY BREEDS CONTEMPT

19th December 2010, 12:58 AM	#102
old school Former Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: miami Posts: 23	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP to its correct diam.sure[crown reduction]

19th December 2010, 02:40 AM	#103
old school Former Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: miami Posts: 23	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP well im personal friends with dr. ed gilman,al shiego,george fistpatrick,the late al shiego,the leaders internationly,and the big fans of crown reduction,this is coming from guys that devote there whole lives to the arborculture world,they get hundreds of thousands of dollers of gov.grants to plant trees just to make certain diffent cuts on them to see whats the best now ten years 20 30 40 years down the line,,,,but directly from the mouth a good pruned tree is a tree thats not pruned lol,but thats for the forest we need to take in consideration residental your house,what do you want a 100+ pine over your kids bedroom,wheather your in florida where a huracain will blow the tree and snap it in half ,or the soked root system fails and falls over,or northen ice storms crack them in half,either weather condition your tree is now in your sons bed,so me ill throw on my hooks go up there and cut it as close or right on hopfully to the 1 third rule,why wait for nature to make the choice for you,cause if you do now you got a busted up house ,and still have 2 put on your hooks go up and now cut it to whatevers left, now you might be forced to hatrack lol when the right cut coud of ben preformed in the first place,and i dont no about you but i only ben doin trees my hole life now i have 2 hire a contracter to fix my house cause i cant lol

19th December 2010, 03:06 PM	#104
Jeff Darby Moderator - Previously known as JayD Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: TreeWorld, Sydney Australia Posts: 2,025	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Out of curiosity how old were you when met Dr Shigo ? I would have loved to meet the late Dr Shigo ! __________________ Member: Australian Tree Association Join the Australian Tree Association...Have your voice heard ! Arboriculture, A life long study for some, a passing phase for others © Jeffrey J Darby 2011

19th December 2010, 09:05 PM	#106
Apocalypsse Veteran Heritage Status Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 1,154	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Forgot about this thread. I'll have to get some pictures in a few weeks when I'm back up there. Mitchell Shire Council have had the Robinia's on the main street of Kilmore topped, they were nicely formed trees, no overhead powerlines to cut out parts of the tree, just prune back from buildings. Now they are ugly sticks with fluff on them. Not sure if it was council or a contractor though.

20th December 2010, 10:45 AM	#107
Eric Frei Admin - Razor sharp and independent 2 X Diploma Level 5 qualified arborist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brisbane Posts: 12,792	Re: To TOP or Not to TOP Hey Old School, What does Giman and Shigo say (or said) about spurring/spiking your prune jobs? __________________ Protect your rights to work - Join Australian Tree Association My businesses:- Qualified Brisbane Tree Lopping \| Stump Grinding Brisbane \| Brisbane - Gold Coast Consulting Arborist

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